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6/03/2017 9:10 PM  #1


My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

When I got back to Dallas from Colorado after the 2016 bash, my rear main seal was leaking. I had pretty severe fuel issues on the trip after buying gas in Tucumcari, NM.  I wonder if the rich running could have caused it?  I had changed to 50 WT racing oil before the trip. Was using 15W40 before the trip. Now have swapped back to thinner oil.

The 3.70:1 rear gears installed before the trip did very well, other than they made some gear noise since the day they were installed.  Someday will get that fixed, but with all the other noise the car makes, it is tolerable.

Other than those two issues, I had considered the car FINISHED, meaning I finally got all the mods done to it that I have in mind right now.  My lightweight theme included an aluminum Dart big bore windsor type 427 stroker. There are no Ford parts on the engine except the dipstick tube, dipstick and the harmonic balancer bolt.  The shiftng is through a TKO600 manual trans with a Centerforce clutch. The rear end is a custom width 9" rear with a Strange aluminum case and 3.70 gears with a traction lock.  I used a Griffin big tube 24" clamp-in aluminum 1970 radiator with a 70 Boss 302 shroud.

All that lightweight stuff makes the car handle really well. Suspension is Progressive Motorsports front coils with 1/2 coil cut. Global West upper control arms, Shelby drop, Bilstein shocks, 15/16" sway bar, Buzek adjustable strut rods, opentracker perches and Total Control power rack are the components. Brakes are 13" Cobra discs with MustangSteve booster and cable clutch system.

Rear consists of the custom 9" housing mounted on GrabATrack 4-1/2 leaf reverse eye springs with 1/2" lowering blocks.  No rear sway bar is used.

Front wheels are 17x7, 4.72" backspace with 225 x 45 tires and 17x8, 5.72" backspace rears with 245x45 tires.  Rear discs are 11.75" cobra.

Exhaust is JBA shorty headers and 2-1/2" stainless pipes. Walker quiet flow mufflers keep the sound level reasonable and there is no drone. Modified GT tips are used. They were modified to maintain 2-1/2" ID.   

My next plans for the car are replacing the rear main seal and restoring the strut rods back to stock type with Moog rubber bushings.
Once those items are done, I am calling the car finished and I plan on just going into Maintenance mode.  I would like to take off a while to do some traveling and boating and spend a little time not in the garage. We are moving in August, so that will help me gear up for other interests. Once I get a new shop building constructed at the lake, maybe then I might consider another project. And it might juet be a truck, as well.


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
 

6/03/2017 11:19 PM  #2


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

What PCV breather setup do you have on the engine?

My experience:
Before I touched it:  Ford 302 already installed by PO, was told the engine was from a '71 F150 though I've not verified the year myself.  PCV was in the passenger valve cover with hose connected to large port directly in the intake manifold right behind carb along with transmission vac line to a small port just below it.  Driver's valve cover had a breather oil cap.

My bright idea:  I thought I'd rather not have any oil vapor from the PCV going back through the intake so I routed the PCV to atmosphere and plugged the intake PCV port.  I left the vented oil cap untouched. Result: engine idled better; however, oil poured out of the rear main seal onto the carport floor.  My bright idea sucked big time.  Seems the engine needs the vacuum in the crankcase to support the rear main seal, at least in my engine.  So I reconnected the PCV to the intake port.  The oil leak slowed to drops but did not go away.  Actually, I always had some oil on the floor there but it was pretty small.  Now it is a steady drop but at least the oil shower was gone.

Bright idea number 2:  I thought that since I had to connect the PCV to the intake port I did not want to create my own vacuum leak via the vented oil cap in the driver's valve cover.  After all, that can't be good for the AFR tuning.  So I replaced the vented oil cap with a low profile solid cap.  Engine runs great and the rear main seal is now dry.  Not even a drop from there.

I'm not sure if this experience will help with your engine; however, if it were mine I'd connect the PCV this way as a test before I did any major engine work.
 

Last edited by Rufus68 (6/03/2017 11:22 PM)


1968 T-code Coupe with a 302.  Nice car, no show stopper for sure, but I like it.
 

6/03/2017 11:26 PM  #3


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Oh to be retired with a nice big shop to work in......... I may just pull the plug next year. 50 years twisting wrenches on aircraft is long enough - although there is a Boeing Museum of Flight restoration facility at Paine Field, only a mile from my house. They love experienced volunteers to work on their aircraft..... We shall see.
Good luck on the move and new shop. As far as the boating - it's great when you have someone to go with you. I lost my best fishing partner last August when my dad died. I have the boat up for sale. Anyone interested in a nice old 26 ft 1979 Bayliner Saratoga? Very clean and well maintained......
I got the new trans controller installed in my 68 - and it actually seems to shift smoother. I think the extra input from the tachometer helps.


68 coupe - 351W, 4R70W, 9" 3.25 -- 65 convertible - 289 4v, C4, 8" 3.00
 

6/04/2017 7:10 PM  #4


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Rufus68 wrote:

What PCV breather setup do you have on the engine?

My experience:
Before I touched it:  Ford 302 already installed by PO, was told the engine was from a '71 F150 though I've not verified the year myself.  PCV was in the passenger valve cover with hose connected to large port directly in the intake manifold right behind carb along with transmission vac line to a small port just below it.  Driver's valve cover had a breather oil cap.

My bright idea:  I thought I'd rather not have any oil vapor from the PCV going back through the intake so I routed the PCV to atmosphere and plugged the intake PCV port.  I left the vented oil cap untouched. Result: engine idled better; however, oil poured out of the rear main seal onto the carport floor.  My bright idea sucked big time.  Seems the engine needs the vacuum in the crankcase to support the rear main seal, at least in my engine.  So I reconnected the PCV to the intake port.  The oil leak slowed to drops but did not go away.  Actually, I always had some oil on the floor there but it was pretty small.  Now it is a steady drop but at least the oil shower was gone.

Bright idea number 2:  I thought that since I had to connect the PCV to the intake port I did not want to create my own vacuum leak via the vented oil cap in the driver's valve cover.  After all, that can't be good for the AFR tuning.  So I replaced the vented oil cap with a low profile solid cap.  Engine runs great and the rear main seal is now dry.  Not even a drop from there.

I'm not sure if this experience will help with your engine; however, if it were mine I'd connect the PCV this way as a test before I did any major engine work.
 

I wouldn't route your pcv hose directly into the intake. They were always ran to the air cleaner housing before the filter. There is a great potential for a vacuum leak or oil consumption down the road. I will shoot a guess and say the reason your rear main is not leaking now is because you are essentially putting your crank case under a vaccuum with the sealed filler cap

Last edited by MachTJ (6/04/2017 7:13 PM)

 

6/04/2017 7:17 PM  #5


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

MachTJ wrote:

I wouldn't route your pcv hose directly into the intake. They were always ran to the air cleaner housing before the filter. There is a great potential for a vacuum leak or oil consumption down the road. I will shoot a guess and say the reason your rear main is not leaking now is because you are essentially putting your crank case under a vaccuum with the sealed filler cap

Thanks, but the fitting in the intake manifold is not uncommon.  Also, the alternative location is a fitting on the base of the carb. Therefore I'm fine with it routed as it is.
 

Last edited by Rufus68 (6/04/2017 7:21 PM)


1968 T-code Coupe with a 302.  Nice car, no show stopper for sure, but I like it.
 

6/05/2017 10:25 AM  #6


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Rufus68 wrote:

MachTJ wrote:

I wouldn't route your pcv hose directly into the intake. They were always ran to the air cleaner housing before the filter. There is a great potential for a vacuum leak or oil consumption down the road. I will shoot a guess and say the reason your rear main is not leaking now is because you are essentially putting your crank case under a vaccuum with the sealed filler cap

Thanks, but the fitting in the intake manifold is not uncommon.  Also, the alternative location is a fitting on the base of the carb. Therefore I'm fine with it routed as it is.
 

Your set up is all wrong, the PCV can't remove the blow by gases because the system can't draw any air.

Your oil will be black in a matter of miles.  If you remove that closed oil cap the cylinder you have the pcv hooked to will miss.  PCV has to draw vacuum from all cylinders, thats why they hook up to the carb or base plate.
The reason people use the fitting on a runner is they don't understand how the system works, that doesn't make it right

Here is article explaining how the PCV works http://mewagner.com/?p=1719

Also there is info on the Wagner Dual flow PCV which is very good for engines that any changes have been made from stock

 

6/05/2017 11:27 AM  #7


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Didn't the early Shelbys have their pcv hook up to a runner?   There was no base plate where the 715 Holley
bolted to the intake.

 

6/05/2017 1:39 PM  #8


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Grabber Blu wrote:

Your set up is all wrong, the PCV can't remove the blow by gases because the system can't draw any air.
...

My set up is perfect, but thank you.  The source of the gasses being evacuated is the blow by itself.  I don't want to be drawing air into my intake system that is not passing through the carburetor. 


1968 T-code Coupe with a 302.  Nice car, no show stopper for sure, but I like it.
 

6/06/2017 1:36 PM  #9


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Grabber Blu wrote:

Your set up is all wrong, the PCV can't remove the blow by gases because the system can't draw any air.

Your oil will be black in a matter of miles.  If you remove that closed oil cap the cylinder you have the pcv hooked to will miss.  PCV has to draw vacuum from all cylinders, thats why they hook up to the carb or base plate.
The reason people use the fitting on a runner is they don't understand how the system works, that doesn't make it right

Here is article explaining how the PCV works http://mewagner.com/?p=1719

Also there is info on the Wagner Dual flow PCV which is very good for engines that any changes have been made from stock

Great info in that article. The diagram at the top of the article is the only way a properly functioning PCV system should be configured with the exception of how the fresh air source inlet is handled (filtered in all cases). And thanks for the tip Grabber Blu. Just ordered the M/E Wagner valve, this will go on the new motor which is getting closer to being ready. It is an investment but I think it's worth it.


(Pinto!)
 

6/06/2017 1:39 PM  #10


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Oh, AND, your '66 is an inspiration MS. I think you should let her be done, enjoy cruising and start something new when the time comes to tinker again. Did you get rid of the F-100 project you were working on a couple of years ago?


(Pinto!)
 

6/06/2017 1:42 PM  #11


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

McStang wrote:

Grabber Blu wrote:

Your set up is all wrong, the PCV can't remove the blow by gases because the system can't draw any air.

Your oil will be black in a matter of miles.  If you remove that closed oil cap the cylinder you have the pcv hooked to will miss.  PCV has to draw vacuum from all cylinders, thats why they hook up to the carb or base plate.
The reason people use the fitting on a runner is they don't understand how the system works, that doesn't make it right

Here is article explaining how the PCV works http://mewagner.com/?p=1719

Also there is info on the Wagner Dual flow PCV which is very good for engines that any changes have been made from stock

Great info in that article. The diagram at the top of the article is the only way a properly functioning PCV system should be configured with the exception of how the fresh air source inlet is handled (filtered in all cases). And thanks for the tip Grabber Blu. Just ordered the M/E Wagner valve, this will go on the new motor which is getting closer to being ready. It is an investment but I think it's worth it.

It is pricey but when look at the workmanship and the packaging/spare parts you'll feel it's worth it besides it will be customized to your set up
 

 

6/06/2017 3:09 PM  #12


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

MS wrote:

There are no Ford parts on the engine except the dipstick tube, dipstick and the harmonic balancer bolt.

I find this fascinating for some reason. I had to think for a minute to remember mine. Ford block, con rods, dipstick and tube.
 
Bob


Bob. 69 Mach 1, 393W, SMOD Toploader, Armstrong  steering, factory AC.
 

6/06/2017 9:05 PM  #13


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Love your Mustang MS!   I'm owned my 69 for 25 years this summer.  It has the original 302 block but everything else has been modified.  It leaks oil from the Rear main Seal and I've tried a couple times to fix it. I'm ok with the leak.  The engine runs good and the t5 shifts well.   The Axle has a leak on a seam that needs to be welded.  I might fix that this summer.  I'm to the point where I might add AC next winter but I'm to ready for the maintenance mode too.  I'm kind of sick of working on it and ready for a newer 2015.  It probably will never make any MS bash since I don't trust it that far.  But I do like taking it out for a cruise around home and taking it to the local cruises.   Steve69

 

6/08/2017 12:02 PM  #14


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Steve69, my old Versailles rear axle housing also had a seam that had a leak.  I cleaned it really well and smeared some black RTV about 1/8" thick across the leak.  It never leaked again.

Miraculously, and perhaps temporarily, my rear main seal no longer leaves a drip on the garage floor.  Changing from the 50 weight racing oil I used on the trip back to 10w30 seems to have had some effect.  That is the only change I made since I got home.  It leaked from the Colorado bash until about a month ago.  Changed the oil and the garage floor is now drip free.

Note:  It is hard to type with fingers crossed!


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     Thread Starter
 

6/08/2017 6:51 PM  #15


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Interesting"DISCUSSION" on PCV valves!
What IS the best PCV for a heavily "cammed" engine? I do know/think the Hi-Po 289 used a different PCV from the standard fare 289. Would the PVC from a boss 302 be better?
Reason I ask....when I was initially working the "kinks" out of my engine I kept hereing a tick/tick/tick/ sound that just wasn't right. Turned out it was the ball in the PCV clicking up and down when the engine was idling !!
I slipped a piece of tubing inside my PCV hose(reducing slightly the diameter of the hose) and the clicking stopped!!
Just wonder what the "proper" fix should be?!
Thanx
6sal6


Get busy Liv'in or get busy Die'n....Host of the 2020 Bash at the Beach/The only Bash that got cancelled  )8
 

6/08/2017 8:50 PM  #16


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

MS wrote:

Steve69, my old Versailles rear axle housing also had a seam that had a leak.  I cleaned it really well and smeared some black RTV about 1/8" thick across the leak.  It never leaked again.

Miraculously, and perhaps temporarily, my rear main seal no longer leaves a drip on the garage floor.  Changing from the 50 weight racing oil I used on the trip back to 10w30 seems to have had some effect.  That is the only change I made since I got home.  It leaked from the Colorado bash until about a month ago.  Changed the oil and the garage floor is now drip free.

Note:  It is hard to type with fingers crossed!

    I put some of your Miracle Rear Main Seal leak and its seem to help a little.  I need to put some more miles on to see if it will work itself in a little bit better.   I might try the thicker oil too next spring.  Thanks for the RTV tip.  I did put some JB weld on it and it helped but no totally.  Ill try a little RTV on it too.  Thanks Steve69
 

 

5/11/2018 6:18 AM  #17


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

MS wrote:

When I got back to Dallas from Colorado after the 2016 bash, my rear main seal was leaking. I had pretty severe fuel issues on the trip after buying gas in Tucumcari, NM. I wonder if the rich running could have caused it? I had changed to 50 WT racing oil before the trip. Was using 15W40 before the trip. Now have swapped back to thinner oil.

The 3.70:1 rear gears installed before the trip did very well, other than they made some gear noise since the day they were installed. Someday will get that fixed, but with all the other noise the car makes, it is tolerable.

Other than those two issues, I had considered the car FINISHED, meaning I finally got all the mods done to it that I have in mind right now. My lightweight theme included an aluminum Dart big bore windsor type 427 stroker. There are no Ford parts on the engine except the dipstick tube, dipstick and the harmonic balancer bolt. The shiftng is through a TKO600 manual trans with a Centerforce clutch. The rear end is a custom width 9" rear with a Strange aluminum case and 3.70 gears with a traction lock. I used a Griffin big tube 24" clamp-in aluminum 1970 radiator with a 70 Boss 302 shroud.

All that lightweight stuff makes the car handle really well. Suspension is Progressive Motorsports front coils with 1/2 coil cut. Global West upper control arms, Shelby drop, Bilstein shocks, 15/16" sway bar, Buzek adjustable strut rods, opentracker perches and Total Control power rack are the components. Brakes are 13" Cobra discs with MustangSteve booster and cable clutch system.

Rear consists of the custom 9" housing mounted on GrabATrack 4-1/2 leaf reverse eye springs with 1/2" lowering blocks. No rear sway bar is used.

Front wheels are 17x7, 4.72" backspace with 225 x 45 tires and 17x8, 5.72" backspace rears with 245x45 tires. Rear discs are 11.75" cobra.

Exhaust is JBA shorty headers and 2-1/2" stainless pipes. Walker quiet flow mufflers keep the sound level reasonable and there is no drone. Modified GT tips are used. They were modified to maintain 2-1/2" ID.

My next plans for the car are replacing the rear main seal and restoring the strut rods back to stock type with Moog rubber bushings.
Once those items are done, I am calling the car finished and I plan on just going into Maintenance mode. I would like to take off a while to do some traveling and boating and spend a little time not in the garage. We are moving in August, so that will help me gear up for other interests. Once I get a new shop building constructed at the lake, maybe then I might consider another project. And it might juet be a truck, as well.

How are things going on this front Steve? Your fastback is an amazing machine. You seemed to do a lot of R&D on it over the years. Things I would never be game to do.


1964-1/2 D Code Coupe - 289 V8, 4 Speed Toploader, 3.00 ratio rear, Autolite 4100 Carb, 15" tires, Pertronix ignition
 

5/11/2018 8:36 AM  #18


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

The car is alive and well once again.  Now, with a smaller, more torque type camshaft, new set of roller lifters, and a new premium rear main seal, it runs fantastic.  I had to replace my Optima battery because it went bad after sitting for four months after we moved.

It runs great


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     Thread Starter
 

5/12/2018 3:08 PM  #19


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

MS wrote:

My lightweight theme included an aluminum Dart big bore windsor type 427 stroker. ... I used a Griffin big tube 24" clamp-in aluminum 1970 radiator with a 70 Boss 302 shroud.

All that lightweight stuff makes the car handle really well.

I have to ask - what is the weight difference (overall) between what you have now and what you had with the 351W in it? 


Founding Member of the Perpetually Bewildered Society
 

5/12/2018 3:57 PM  #20


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Total weight of engine and tranny is 350 pounds.  I am not sure of the difference.


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     Thread Starter
 

5/12/2018 6:01 PM  #21


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

Steve, I lost track of what happened to the car when the teenage girl ran into you and you had the dreadful experience with that body shop. How did that all pan out? If I remember correctly, you were going to have the whole front end clipped and on a hinge type set up? Did you end up retrieving the car and finishing the repair yourself?


1964-1/2 D Code Coupe - 289 V8, 4 Speed Toploader, 3.00 ratio rear, Autolite 4100 Carb, 15" tires, Pertronix ignition
 

5/14/2018 9:10 PM  #22


Re: My 66 fastback after the last Bash trip to Colorado.

The car was repaired with NOS parts and rebuilt as original.


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     Thread Starter
 

Board footera


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