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11/12/2018 10:55 AM  #1


4R70W conversion

Short of the controller , What other parts are needed to convert from C 6 ? This is a 71 mustang , I know the transmission  mount and shorten drive shaft , As far as other stuff what do I need ? I am thinking of going used transmission and have read that I should look for a 01 mustang 3.8 v6 as a donor.


If its worth doing do it right !
 

11/12/2018 12:08 PM  #2


Re: 4R70W conversion

You'll need to do something about a shifter.  Probably can mod the C6 shifter to do the job.  I've been told that one should change the torque converter to a V8 unit but also been told it's not necessary for normal street use.  If you are running a mean 351 you may want to talk to Bauman when you order the controller...assuming that's what you use...about the TC.
Ford removed the speedo drive gear from 03 forward but apparently some of the 03 units still had one...mine does ... so make sure anything you get has it or you'll need to mess with that.

BB
 


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

11/12/2018 3:43 PM  #3


Re: 4R70W conversion

What motor will the 4r70w mount to? My C6 (460) is much longer than my C4 and FMX. A trans X member is usually required, unless you can fab yours.


Bob. 69 Mach 1, 393W, SMOD Toploader, Armstrong  steering, factory AC.
 

11/12/2018 3:59 PM  #4


Re: 4R70W conversion

The 2001/2002's (and maybe 3's) will have some upgraded internals over the early units so it is best to find one of those years if you can.  The 4R70W output housing/bushing is larger than most older transmissions, perhaps even bigger OD than your C6.  The factory yoke, at least on the long-shaft models, also uses a different size/style u-joint which may not mate up with your shortened driveshaft.  The best option for me was a new slip-yoke from Spicer.  https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sdh-2-3-14061x  For me it was worth the $60.  Alternatively, you could try to find an output housing from an AOD.  It uses the same shaft and spline diameter but the bushing is sized for the C4 slip yoke.  If your C6 yoke won't fit anyway, I'd opt for the new Spicer unit.

 

11/12/2018 7:31 PM  #5


Re: 4R70W conversion

If you are possibly looking for a good rear transmission mount for a 4R70W, Joe Persad at premiergenerator@gmail.com sells a good one. I used his on my 4R70W install to my 351W in my 68.
Check out the picture here: http://fyi.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?id=4863


68 coupe - 351W, 4R70W, 9" 3.25 -- 65 convertible - 289 4v, C4, 8" 3.00
 

11/12/2018 7:49 PM  #6


Re: 4R70W conversion

Ron68 wrote:

If you are possibly looking for a good rear transmission mount for a 4R70W, Joe Persad at premiergenerator@gmail.com sells a good one. I used his on my 4R70W install to my 351W in my 68.
Check out the picture here: http://fyi.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?id=4863

Hi Ron, when are we gonna see you again at a Bash? 
And, what torque converter are you running in your 68?  I've been told that you need to upgrade from the V6 to a V8 TC...and then I've heard that you really don't.

I have an 03 trans plus the 94 computer that I plan to slip into the Heap one of these winters and I don't want to buy a different TC unless I really have to.

Thanks, hope to see you again some day.

BB


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

11/12/2018 9:30 PM  #7


Re: 4R70W conversion

Wading through the various founded and unfounded data, it appears that the limiting factor on the V6 converter is the lock-up clutch torque capacity.  Apparently they are good to approximately 350 ft-lbs.  Above that, slip and excessive heat can take out the converter and the trans.  However, with some relatively easy programming in the Baumann unit, you can have the trans "unlock" under certain operating conditions which should prevent/limit this.  With a healthy 5.0, you should be OK.  A stout 351 Windsor or Cleveland would do better with another TC.  I am running a TC from a 5.4 truck in my 1970 F-250 behind the 390 and soon to be 445.  It is considered a low-stall and also has a lower torque multiplication factor of 1.1 which should allow the 4R to survive.  The hot setup is supposed to be the Mercury Marauder TC with a little higher stall but it may take a small bolt-pattern flex plate.  The 3.8 V6 and the 4.6 V8 are don't make gobs of low-end torque like a good Windsor 5.0 so they have higher stall speeds that you may not really need. 

All that said Bob, if you decide you want to start with a fresh unit with a pick up stall speeds, my neighbor gets good units for about $150 exchange in Denver.  90% chance that your used V6 converter will work fine in your car.  For me, I seem to always fall into that 10% category.  Murphy and I are close friends.

Internally, the V6 trans is supposed to have one less clutch than the 4.6 cars.   Looks like properly sourced parts cost about $20 bucks but you'll have to open it up to install.  Not a huge ordeal.  For a 5.0, it may be fine.  For a 351, I'd probably do the upgrade.  All the other components are essentially the same.  

 

11/13/2018 7:27 AM  #8


Re: 4R70W conversion

Thanks for the good info, Gary.  I'm tempted to stuff it in as is.  I've always been one of those guys that just has to rebuild everything but this time I may take a chance.  Probably next winter if I can figure out how to deal with a Moats Q-Horse and Tuner Pro.

BB


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

11/13/2018 2:07 PM  #9


Re: 4R70W conversion

My info so far the 3.8 4r70w would most likely stand up to the 351 w with its 400 ft pounds of torque . But the stock convertor may be the weak point, When I started this project way back when Aod conversion were just starting so I went back to the stock transmission a C-6 . Now that I can see a completion to this , Now thinking about driving it and with 3.55 rear gears it will be cranking a highway speeds


If its worth doing do it right !
     Thread Starter
 

11/13/2018 3:04 PM  #10


Re: 4R70W conversion

KM wrote:

My info so far the 3.8 4r70w would most likely stand up to the 351 w with its 400 ft pounds of torque . But the stock convertor may be the weak point, When I started this project way back when Aod conversion were just starting so I went back to the stock transmission a C-6 . Now that I can see a completion to this , Now thinking about driving it and with 3.55 rear gears it will be cranking a highway speeds

I presently have an AOD with 3:55 gears.  It turns just under 2250 at 70 with 25" tires.  You'll be pushing 3350 with the C6.  I think you'll be happier with some kind of OD.

BB


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

11/14/2018 12:17 AM  #11


Re: 4R70W conversion

Bullet Bob wrote:

Ron68 wrote:

If you are possibly looking for a good rear transmission mount for a 4R70W, Joe Persad at premiergenerator@gmail.com sells a good one. I used his on my 4R70W install to my 351W in my 68.
Check out the picture here: http://fyi.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?id=4863

Hi Ron, when are we gonna see you again at a Bash? 
And, what torque converter are you running in your 68?  I've been told that you need to upgrade from the V6 to a V8 TC...and then I've heard that you really don't.

I have an 03 trans plus the 94 computer that I plan to slip into the Heap one of these winters and I don't want to buy a different TC unless I really have to.

Thanks, hope to see you again some day.

BB

The transmission I have in my 68 is from a 1998 F-150 4.2L. I have a V8 stall converter in the transmission. As far as me making it to a bash - They all seem to be out of range for me - always in the deep south or east of the Mississippi. We never seem to have any on the west coast (except for yours in Colorado, which I couldn't make) I have made two in Texas and one in Montana - but maybe when I pull the plug at work, I'll have more time to make one of those far away bashes. It's a very long way to drive my 68 to any of the bashes of late from  Seattle. Once retired, I can maybe take advantage of those travel benefits I have earned from 35 years of twisting wrenches on Alaska Airlines aircraft. Until then, I'll just have to live vicariously by looking at all the photos posted.....
 


68 coupe - 351W, 4R70W, 9" 3.25 -- 65 convertible - 289 4v, C4, 8" 3.00
 

11/14/2018 7:36 AM  #12


Re: 4R70W conversion

I do understand, Ron.  Never less than a two day drive for us...Florida was a four day drive each way and we only stayed in state 24 hours.  We'll likely take three days to get to Bob & Cindy's in July.  Yup, if I weren't retired it would be pretty well impossible.  As far as too far for the 68, well, I guess I just think different. 
All the best to you.

BB
 


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

Board footera


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