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9/07/2021 6:52 PM  #1


Post burnout stall - ideas?

I have plunged deep into carburetor voodoo and have made great strides with tuning my 351C.

Drivability is good, but if I mat the go pedal for a burnout and drop out quick it will stall (when I let off).

378" Cleveland, 279/289 cam, shorty headers, CHI 2V heads, and Frankenstein Barry Grant 750 speed Demon)(Holley clone, 4 corner idle, vacuum secondary).  My idle AFR is in the 13:1 range.  low speed cruise varies from 14-17:1.  70 MPH on the freeway is about 13.5:1, and when matted it drops to about 12.5:1

Almost seems like it floods out when I stall it.  I had a buddy suggest that I may be running my fuel level too high in the bowls.  I'm about 2/3rds of the way up the sight glasses.

Any ideas?  No I am not going with fuel injection.

 

 

9/07/2021 6:59 PM  #2


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

I know nothing about Speed Demons but on big Holley’s the fuel level should be at the very  bottom of the sight glass.
Fuel should not leak out when the site glass is removed.


Good work ain't cheap, Cheap work ain't good!   Simple Man
 

9/07/2021 8:04 PM  #3


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

I would think you might want to check fuel pressure during hard acceleration


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
 

9/07/2021 8:57 PM  #4


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

You might try upping the idle just to see if a little extra throttle plate opening keeps it from stalling. How tight is your return spring?

 

9/08/2021 11:23 AM  #5


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

Throttle return spring is strong.  Butterfly is set to show a square shape of the transition slot.  I'm wondering if this has something to do with me hooking up the vacuum advance to the non-ported source.  When I whack the throttle and let off the vacuum skyrockets, which is advancing the timing a ton as it is returning to idle.  If I went with ported vac to the distributor the vac signal to the distributor would be zero as soon as the butterflies close. 

I need to go do some more test driving, but I am going to wait until the smoke / ash is better from the surrounding wildfires.

     Thread Starter
 

9/08/2021 2:21 PM  #6


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

Vacuum advance is a loooong time in the past for my old hot rod.
I want my total advance to be @ 36+ or- a dab.....butt stable.
Vac advance (I know the reasoning behind vac. adv.!) is just one more thang to try and keep up with for a very small gain  IMHO.
With a 378 cu. in. Cleveland.....snotty cam....trick heads and....trick carb is a couple more mile per gallon really a concern with  400+ HP in the mix??!
"Com-'on man!"
I'd play with the float level....bump the idle a dab....plug the Vac/adv. and.... see what she does
6s6


Get busy Liv'in or get busy Die'n....Host of the 2020 Bash at the Beach/The only Bash that got cancelled  )8
 

9/12/2021 6:04 PM  #7


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

Yesterday I took it out for a 35 mile trip with the float levels lowered and it would still do the stall / idle bounce when returning to idle post burnout.

I took apart the MSD distributor today and was able to swap out the vacuum canister for the delete kit.  Wasn't too bad.  Played around with initial timing.  Seemed like hot starts had the potential to make some racket when I went at or above 16 degrees BTDC initial.  Settled in on just less than 14 degrees initial, about 34 total.  Ran it around on about 2/3rds 91 pump gas and 1/3rd 93 ethanol free.  The car had excellent manners.  I think I may be leaving a little horsepower on the table so I will try a different mechanical advance stop in the distributor to get me up to 36 degrees total.  Making big steps towards this thing having street manners and tire disposal capabilities.  Really happy with how it ran.


My guess is that before I had my initial about 10 degrees, and the vacuum advance would toss another 15 degrees or so on top of that when the throttle snapped shut and the vacuum peaked.  That took the idle timing into the no-go zone and calamity ensued as the engine flat out stall or have this wicked idle bounce as it was chasing its tail timing wise.  This is probably why every single MSD paper I could find said to used the ported vacuum for the advance- and I was using the straight vac port...

Also found this cool white paper of sorts on timing.
http://www.firstfives.org/faq/timing/timing_for_modified_engines.PDF

 

     Thread Starter
 

9/12/2021 9:21 PM  #8


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

Bentworker wrote:

Yesterday I took it out for a 35 mile trip with the float levels lowered and it would still do the stall / idle bounce when returning to idle post burnout.

I took apart the MSD distributor today and was able to swap out the vacuum canister for the delete kit.  Wasn't too bad.  Played around with initial timing.  Seemed like hot starts had the potential to make some racket when I went at or above 16 degrees BTDC initial.  Settled in on just less than 14 degrees initial, about 34 total.  Ran it around on about 2/3rds 91 pump gas and 1/3rd 93 ethanol free.  The car had excellent manners.  I think I may be leaving a little horsepower on the table so I will try a different mechanical advance stop in the distributor to get me up to 36 degrees total.  Making big steps towards this thing having street manners and tire disposal capabilities.  Really happy with how it ran.


My guess is that before I had my initial about 10 degrees, and the vacuum advance would toss another 15 degrees or so on top of that when the throttle snapped shut and the vacuum peaked.  That took the idle timing into the no-go zone and calamity ensued as the engine flat out stall or have this wicked idle bounce as it was chasing its tail timing wise.  This is probably why every single MSD paper I could find said to used the ported vacuum for the advance- and I was using the straight vac port...

Also found this cool white paper of sorts on timing.
http://www.firstfives.org/faq/timing/timing_for_modified_engines.PDF

Sounds like you are "zeroing-in-on-it!!!!"
Play with lighter springs to bring in total advance quicker!
Sounds like the MSD has a BUNCH of adjustments for all different sorts of advance curve.
Like the "white paper" sez....be aware of too much advance!
The Clevland  heads are pretty efficient so 36* may be too much total.
Try bringing it in quicker and limit it to 34-36degrees.
'Some" set ups have the weights wired open so there is NO advance at all!
Good starter and strong battery will crank it  locked out at 36!!
Prolly a racing fuel... drag race piece situation.(good illustration of how all sorts of curves are possible!)
6sally6

 

 


Get busy Liv'in or get busy Die'n....Host of the 2020 Bash at the Beach/The only Bash that got cancelled  )8
 

9/27/2021 10:44 PM  #9


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

I drove the car on a 130 mile trip this weekend.  I think the problem is solved.  Also have to say that adding a fuel pressure regulator and not relying solely on my mechanical pump was something I should have done a long time ago.

     Thread Starter
 

9/27/2021 11:48 PM  #10


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

Is that a Wagner PCV valve you're running?

 

9/28/2021 8:50 AM  #11


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

Yep- so far so good with the Wagner PCV.

     Thread Starter
 

9/28/2021 9:18 AM  #12


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

Bentworker wrote:

Yep- so far so good with the Wagner PCV.

Thanks. I'm about to order one...

 

9/29/2021 12:07 AM  #13


Re: Post burnout stall - ideas?

josh-kebob wrote:

Bentworker wrote:

Yep- so far so good with the Wagner PCV.

Thanks. I'm about to order one...

Josh there was recently a group buy on VMF where the cost was around $100. I'd check on it, send the email to Wagner and see if they'll honor the reduced group price.

Last edited by Bearing Bob (9/29/2021 12:07 AM)


Bob. 69 Mach 1, 393W, SMOD Toploader, Armstrong  steering, factory AC.
 

Board footera


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