FYI FORD - MustangSteve's Ford Mustang Forum
The Internet's Most Knowledgeable Classic Mustang Information
IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT CLASSIC FORD MUSTANGS, YOU HAVE COME TO THE RIGHT PLACE!
MustangSteve has over 30 years of Mustang experience, having owned 30 of them and restored several others. With the help of other Mustangers, this site is dedicated to helping anyone wanting to restore or modify their Mustang.... THERE ARE NO DUMB QUESTIONS!!!!!
Visit MustangSteve's web site to view some of my work and find details for:
FYIFORD Contributors' PICTURES - Power Brake Retrofit Kits for 65-66 Stangs - Classic Mustang FAQ's by MustangSteve - How to wire in a Duraspark Ignition - Mustang Ride Height Pictures and Descriptions - Steel Bushings to fit Granada Spindles to Mustang Tie Rods - Visit my EBAY store MustangSteve Performance - How to Install Granada Disc Brakes MustangSteve's Disc Brake Swap Page - FYIFORD Acronyms for guide to all the acronyms used on this page - FYIFORD Important information and upcoming events

You are not logged in. Would you like to login or register?

4/30/2015 10:25 AM  #26


Re: Rear end

First, I think I asssumed for some reason that you were installing an 8.8 rather than an 8" so the link I posted is for the wrong gears.  There are some good gears out there but from what I have read it is probably best to stick with gears manufactured in the US if you buy new.  With the low first gear in most T-5's you will probably find that you will be replacing the right rear tire more frequently with an open rear so some sort of locking diff is probably better.  It can be added later but you would be paying for the labor to do the gear installation twice.  You may find a good used but make sure you know exactly what is inside as in the early years there were some locking Ford units that were not good and parts are not even available.  

At this point, you should probably consider trying to find a complete 8" pumpkin that is already set up with your desired ratio.  If you build what you have from scratch you are looking at up to $500 for a new differential (I like the Detroit Trutrac http://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/dtl-912a616/overview/  ) and $150 for gears plus the added costs for bearings, seals, labor, etc.  In the 8" a good ratio would be 3.50 if you move ahead.  

What I would suggest for now is to install what you have and see how it runs and find a complete center section that has what you want/need.  When the time comes, pull the axles back and R&R the center section with your new unit and you are set.  I think that you will be money ahead if you approach it this way.  I have not done any searches on used traction-lock diff's or complete center sections but if you are patient you should find what you need or maybe someone on this site is trying to unload one.  In the meantime, enjoy the ride and just buy sacrificial right rear tires.  On the good side, an open rear car is much less likely to swap ends on wet roads.

 

4/30/2015 2:12 PM  #27


Re: Rear end

If the 3.0 is still in good condition, I would live with it for a while and see what you think. I have a 66 with a 302 and a T5 using 215 45/17 tires. I too have an open 3.0 ford 8" rear and first gear is almost useless under full power. I can really chirp second as well. On the freeway it runs around 2500 RPM at 80MPH and I can easily hit 115 mph if neeed. I don't have a good transmission and that is about when I get worried that everything is about to explode on me...
I know for me I am looking to add limited slip to my rear to hopefully solve the trackion issues, other than that the 3.0 is a good compromise for when I am driving the wife and kids around.

Good Luck!
BobN

 

4/30/2015 5:04 PM  #28


Re: Rear end

Did you intend to say 65 MPH in Oregon? Freeways are 65 here in OR
Howard

 

6/09/2015 6:12 PM  #29


Re: Rear end

Back from distractions ( tree houses, vacation, boat woes) and I have thought long and hard, and think I might just do the rear gear swap now that I have it all opened up and out of the car. Also, I think a big deciding factor is this deal I found, it seems like a great deal (all things considerd) please let me know if I am missing something: http://www.quickperformance.com/Ford-8-Trac-Lok-Posi-Ring-Pinion-Gear-Bearing-Kit-Package_p_20369.html

 


All men die, but not all men truly ever live.
     Thread Starter
 

6/10/2015 4:49 AM  #30


Re: Rear end

I'm trying to clarify what rear you have.  If you have an 8" rear the gears noted will not work as they are for the 8.8" rear found under Fox platform cars.

If you have an 8" rear then you'll need gears for an 8".  I have had great success with Yukon gears from Randy's Ring & Pinion.  I've installed around a dozen sets and never had a single issue.  You can find cheaper gears, but they are made in China and will likely whine on deceleration. 

For the differential you could go with a Traction Lok, but honestly the Ford built limited slip diffs are rather weak.  If you're spending money one way or the other I'd rather have a better LSD.  Yukon has one available for the application.  I've had good luck with them.  TruTrac also make an LSD for the application, which is a torque sensing differential.  They have a good reputation too.  There may be others as well. 

On the overhaul kit Yukon sells good stuff with Timken bearings.  I've also had excellent performance from SKF and Koyo bearings over the years.  Again, beware of Chinese stuff with poor quality control.  In general rear end parts are like anything else.  There's always guys out there selling cheap stuff, but you tend to get what you pay for. 

 

6/10/2015 9:40 AM  #31


Re: Rear end

TKOPerformance wrote:

I'm trying to clarify what rear you have.  If you have an 8" rear the gears noted will not work as they are for the 8.8" rear found under Fox platform cars.

If you have an 8" rear then you'll need gears for an 8".  I have had great success with Yukon gears from Randy's Ring & Pinion.  I've installed around a dozen sets and never had a single issue.  You can find cheaper gears, but they are made in China and will likely whine on deceleration. 

For the differential you could go with a Traction Lok, but honestly the Ford built limited slip diffs are rather weak.  If you're spending money one way or the other I'd rather have a better LSD.  Yukon has one available for the application.  I've had good luck with them.  TruTrac also make an LSD for the application, which is a torque sensing differential.  They have a good reputation too.  There may be others as well. 

On the overhaul kit Yukon sells good stuff with Timken bearings.  I've also had excellent performance from SKF and Koyo bearings over the years.  Again, beware of Chinese stuff with poor quality control.  In general rear end parts are like anything else.  There's always guys out there selling cheap stuff, but you tend to get what you pay for. 

Ok to clarify, I currently have an 8in rear end original to the car with 3.0 gears.

I was told by quick performance that this setup here: http://www.quickperformance.com/Ford-8-Trac-Lok-Posi-Ring-Pinion-Gear-Bearing-Kit-Package_p_20369.html   is for an 8in rear end.  He stated the trac-loc is made by Yukon, the gears (3.55) are made by US Gears (Italian made) and the Master bearing kit is all Timken. It seems like a great deal there!


All men die, but not all men truly ever live.
     Thread Starter
 

6/11/2015 10:43 AM  #32


Re: Rear end

TimC wrote:

As McStang indicated, your pic did not post.
 

 
By using the preview link box to the right of the submit box, you can preview your post and see if the pic attached.

Bob


Bob. 69 Mach 1, 393W, SMOD Toploader, Armstrong  steering, factory AC.
 

6/12/2015 4:47 AM  #33


Re: Rear end

Sounds like a very good deal.  I'd jump on that. 

 

6/18/2015 9:15 AM  #34


Re: Rear end

TKOPerformance wrote:

Sounds like a very good deal.  I'd jump on that. 

Came home from work and my package arrived, pretty happy with those guys in the link above! Not sure how they were able to offer such a great deal must buy in bulk, costco style. I will have them installed next week:
Then to finish up on the rear brake disc conversion, there might actually me light at the end of the tunnel, I just keep telling myself this.....


All men die, but not all men truly ever live.
     Thread Starter
 

6/18/2015 2:50 PM  #35


Re: Rear end

I would see what bearings are in their kits.  Honestly, with this stuff you get what you pay for and Summit sells a lot of Chinese made stuff under their name.  I would not feel confident if the bearings are not Timken, Koyo, or SKF.  I buy all my gears and bearings from Randy's Ring & Pinion.  Its all US made, and the gears set up great and make no noise.  You can find the stuff cheaper, but the quality is usually lower and you can get gear whine on deceleration and shortened bearing life.  You can check them out here:

www.ringpinion.com

 

6/18/2015 11:34 PM  #36


Re: Rear end

TKOPerformance wrote:

I would see what bearings are in their kits.  Honestly, with this stuff you get what you pay for and Summit sells a lot of Chinese made stuff under their name.  I would not feel confident if the bearings are not Timken, Koyo, or SKF.  I buy all my gears and bearings from Randy's Ring & Pinion.  Its all US made, and the gears set up great and make no noise.  You can find the stuff cheaper, but the quality is usually lower and you can get gear whine on deceleration and shortened bearing life.  You can check them out here:

www.ringpinion.com

Yeah copy that, I did not however buy these from Summit, but from these guys: http://www.quickperformance.com/Ford-8-Trac-Lok-Posi-Ring-Pinion-Gear-Bearing-Kit-Package_p_20369.html

All the bearings are Timken, and all Yukon, american made.....
 


All men die, but not all men truly ever live.
     Thread Starter
 

7/09/2015 11:21 AM  #37


Re: Rear end

Resurrecting old thread here, but just (finally) got my rear end back, diff prepped/painted, and am just waiting for my leaf springs (4.5 mid-eye) to arrive. With this I got new bolts and shackles, but they did not have U-Bolts in stock, any input on re-using the old ones, should be fine riiiight?  Also, they came with a gasket, but what is the best method re-installing the 3rd member? I have heard use gasket and RTV, some say just RTV? Thanks in advance!
Then to finish the rear disc brake conversion, and make it a roller again, its been on jack stands for a spell!


All men die, but not all men truly ever live.
     Thread Starter
 

7/09/2015 12:18 PM  #38


Re: Rear end

I usually use a gasket and skin both sides with RTV.  It would probably be fine with just RTV, but if nothing else, the gasket makes removing the RTV easier in the future. 

 

7/09/2015 12:24 PM  #39


Re: Rear end

A lot of RTV products do not work well with gear oil over the long haul.  I used this Permatex product when I assembled my rear end.  The gasket does help when taking it back apart because it will split easier than well applied RTV.  http://www.permatex.com/products-2/product-categories/gasketing/gasket-makers/permatex-gear-oil-rtv-gasket-maker-detail

 

7/09/2015 12:34 PM  #40


Re: Rear end

GPatrick wrote:

A lot of RTV products do not work well with gear oil over the long haul.  I used this Permatex product when I assembled my rear end.  The gasket does help when taking it back apart because it will split easier than well applied RTV.  http://www.permatex.com/products-2/product-categories/gasketing/gasket-makers/permatex-gear-oil-rtv-gasket-maker-detail

That makes sense that a gasket would make things easier down the road, if need be I seperate the case (hopefully not, but maybe)  Somebody else recommended permatex, but I had not heard about the possible gear oil/RTV not "complimenting" each other so thanks. With that, I also heard that with a LSD or the trac-loc, I need an additive in the gear oil to stop shuttering or something along those lines?
 


All men die, but not all men truly ever live.
     Thread Starter
 

7/09/2015 12:37 PM  #41


Re: Rear end

For clutch type LSDs, yes, you need an additive.  Typically one bottle in a rear that size will suffice.  Kendall makes a decent friction modifier that certainly smells like the old, now discontinued, Ford stuff.  I buy mine at the local NAPA.  Warning: its stinky stuff!

 

7/09/2015 12:45 PM  #42


Re: Rear end

Some of the universal LSD additives don't work.  Sounds like the Kendall product works.  I was assured that a universal additive would work in my old Explorer and it got worse instead of better (the additive does break down afer a while).  Drained it all and put the Ford stuff in and it immediately cured the problem.  The smellier the better!

 

7/09/2015 12:50 PM  #43


Re: Rear end

Yes, and some gear oils even claim they have the modifier in the oil already.  I can certify that the Kendall stuff works.  Anything else, caveat emptor (buyer beware). 

 

7/09/2015 1:09 PM  #44


Re: Rear end

TKOPerformance wrote:

Yes, and some gear oils even claim they have the modifier in the oil already.  I can certify that the Kendall stuff works.  Anything else, caveat emptor (buyer beware). 

Copy that, thanks gentleman! I will get the permartex, and the Kendall when the time comes)
 


All men die, but not all men truly ever live.
     Thread Starter
 

7/09/2015 8:25 PM  #45


Re: Rear end

While you guys are on the subject of rear ends, I saw a picture of devovino's 9" and was wondering what disc brake set up he is using. I'm working on a '69 fastback with a 9" and I'm hoping to find a caliper adapter kit to allow me to use the rear brakes off of an SN99 Mustang. I'm running the Fat Man strut suspension up front with SN99 brakes. If this subject has already been covered, please direct me to the correct thread. Thank you in advance. I'm a newbie so please cut me some slack.

 

7/09/2015 8:36 PM  #46


Re: Rear end

Sam, take a look at the link below first - a variety of options for 9" rears.  What bearing arrangement do you have on your 9".  The link shows "cobra" but includes other options.  While you will have a lot of hits, try the search function for "rear brakes" and other variations.  Depending on your front brakes, the Cobra brake setup is a good option with still reasonable prices and good wheel selection.  Welcome to the MS forum.

http://www.mustangsteve.com/cobrabrakes.html

 

7/10/2015 8:04 AM  #47


Re: Rear end

I'm a big fan of Explorer discs for daily drviers and street machines, and even limited track use.  I really like the Banska style parking brake, which I find much more reliable than caliper operated systems.  And they're pretty cheap too.  Here's a link to Currie's website showing that option, but there are a lot of places selling this setup too.

http://www.currieenterprises.com/cestore/ProductsRE.aspx?id=1229

 

7/11/2015 2:59 PM  #48


Re: Rear end

The best friction modifier to use is from Ford (part # XL-3 135454). --about $7.00 dollars for a bottle.

Pour the 4 oz. bottle of friction modifier in first then, top off with the gear oil.



 

7/11/2015 3:02 PM  #49


Re: Rear end

My understanding is that the current Motorcraft stuff is a different forumlation from the friction modifier they used to offer.  I've heard some guys swear the new stuff was causing their diff to chatter.  Out of curiosity, what color is that stuff?  The old stuff almost looked like 2-stroke oil. 

 

7/11/2015 3:32 PM  #50


Re: Rear end

TKOPerformance wrote:

My understanding is that the current Motorcraft stuff is a different forumlation from the friction modifier they used to offer.  I've heard some guys swear the new stuff was causing their diff to chatter.  Out of curiosity, what color is that stuff?  The old stuff almost looked like 2-stroke oil. 

Hmmm....

A few months back, I changed out the C7AW-E single vertical rib 28-spline single track differential 9-inch 3rd member casting, in my '69 F100, for a factory Daytona N-case 3rd member, with a 31-spline, 4-pinion Traction-Lok differential. I also swapped out my stock 28-spline axles and installed some factory 31-spline axles.

I can't, for sure, recall the color of the friction modifier --I was more concerned about keeping the smelly stuff from getting on my hands but, seems like it was blue. The differential is quiet as a church mouse though, with no chattering.

Ford Daytona 9-inch N-case with a 31-spline Traction-Lok differential and 3.50 gears from a '75 Ford F150 4x4. 31-spline axles from a 1971 Ford F100 that had a Ford 9-3/8" rear end.



After I cleaned up the N-case.



Stock '69 F100 28-spline 9-inch axle on left, '71 F100 31-spline 9-3/8" axle on the right.



Stock '69 F100 C7AW-E 28-spline open differential 3rd member on the left, '75 F150 4x4 9-inch N-case 31-spline Traction-Lok 3rd member on the right.



N-case in the 9-inch rear end housing of my '69 F100 Ranger.



31-spline axles from the '71 F100 9-3/8" rear end installed in my truck's 9-inch rear end housing.

 

Board footera


REMEMBER!!! When posting a question about your Mustang or other Ford on this forum, BE SURE to tell us what it is, what year, engine, etc so we have enough information to go on.