| ||
Visit MustangSteve's web site to view some of my work and find details for: FYIFORD Contributors' PICTURES - Power Brake Retrofit Kits for 65-66 Stangs - Classic Mustang FAQ's by MustangSteve - How to wire in a Duraspark Ignition - Mustang Ride Height Pictures and Descriptions - Steel Bushings to fit Granada Spindles to Mustang Tie Rods - Visit my EBAY store MustangSteve Performance - How to Install Granada Disc Brakes MustangSteve's Disc Brake Swap Page - FYIFORD Acronyms for guide to all the acronyms used on this page - FYIFORD Important information and upcoming events |
Offline
I'm about to replace the heads on the 302 in my 67 mustang. I've decided to go the cast iron head route on this engine and wondered if anybody on here knows of a place that sells reasonably priced cast heads that flows good or know of one in particular that we be a good idea.
Offline
Personally I would just get a set of Edelbrock aluminum heads. If your reason for wanting iron heads is cost you'll most likely end up with as much tied up in a set of iron heads as the Edelbrocks will cost and the Edlebrocks will still flow better.
GT40 or GT40P heads are very good heads for factory heads, and can be found a lot of places for not a lot of money. BUT, the valvesprings won't work with even a mild cam, so they need to be changed. You are tied to the factory style pedestal rockers or you have to machine them for screw in studs. You need to check them for cracks. They might need to be decked to get the chambers the right size for your desired compression ratio. They should get a good valve job. You probably want to at least port mach them and bowl blend them. By the time you do that you're going to have $800-$900 tied up in a set of heads that still won't flow as well as a set of $1,000 Edelbrocks will.
There might be other offerings out there, but you're going to have a hard time beating $1,000 a set for a ready to run set of heads. The entry level aluminum heads are very reasonably priced now, and work very well.
Another option is to check Craigslist in your area. Mustang heads pop up all the time for not a lot of money.
Offline
If you are dead set on Iron, Dart makes "Iron Eagle" but they are costly. As previously stated going to aluminum has more benefits than Darts with virtually the same price.
Last edited by Rudi (9/29/2016 3:35 PM)
Offline
I had a set of Dart iron eagle heads. I ported them like crazy and they worked great. The weighed a ton! I replaced them with a set of Canfield aluminum heads that cost the exact same and weighed 23 pounds (for both together). The iron is nice for keeping the head gaskets together, but man does it tear up your back to remove a head...For that reason alone I have aluminum heads.
BobN
Offline
Modern aluminum heads on a naturally aspirated engine shouldn't have head gasket issues. Blown applications are always going to have problems because the small block Ford just has too few head bolts. I put studs in instead of bolts on almost every engine I build for cheap insurance, regardless of make. You can o-ring the heads if you are really worried about it, but again, I would only go to such extremes when running a lot of boost. The decks on most aluminum heads are 3/4" thick, whereas iron heads I've seen them as thin as 3/8", sometimes thinner if they've been milled a lot.
Offline
World Product Windsor Jr come in cast iron. Or did.
They're heavy and the valve seals may need looking at.
Years ago they were the best for the money butt Alum has gotten cheaper now
I'd go Alum if I did it again. Mill's down to get 10:1cr . BECAUSE they're Alum
Offline
Yes, there is a bit of a double edged sword with aluminum as it pertains to heat retention/rejection. Iron tends to hold heat, so a lot of people feel that iron headed engines in theory make more power at the same compression ratio than aluminum heads, all things being equal. The counterpoint to that theory is that because aluminum rejects heat much faster than iron you can safely run another point of compression over iron and not have to worry about detonation, again, all things being equal.
My experience has been that all things are never equal and you build the engine to achieve your goals and match the parts accordingly. We ran modified iron heads for years because aluminum heads were too expensive. In the '90s the cost of aluminum heads came way down. They were still a bit pricier than iron, but companies like Edlebrock revolutionized the casting technology to really get the cost down, and the cost of the heads if anything has continued to go down over the years, especially accounting for inflation. I used my first set of aluminum heads in 1998 (Edlebrock 6073 castings for a SBC that I've since reworked and are still going strong with the second engine under them). I never went back to iron. I've investigated them several times for both Fords and Chevys, as both have decent factory offerings that are in theory cheap (GT40/GT40P and Vortec respectively), but the problem is that they both have all the same problems and need massive rework to work on a real performance engine. I've been very happy with Edlebrock's offerings. They are an entry level head at roughly $1,000/set. They don't flow quite as well as say AFRs, but the cost to benefit on them is probably higher than the AFRs, because that little bit more the AFRs get you costs quite a bit more.
I would be sure that whatever you do you build a matched combination. Compression ratio, head intake port volume, camshaft profile, intake manifold, carb, and exhaust all have to be matched to get good results. There is no one magic part that turns an engine from a commuter to a dragstrip hero. Heads are a good starting point, and have the potential to make a massive improvement, especially if you are running 60's, 70's, or early 80's era heads now. BUT, you need all the parts to work together to get the most out of those heads.
Offline
Nice aluminun budget heads at Speed Master...CNC ported...complete...$752 shipped
Last edited by jerseyjoe (9/30/2016 6:54 AM)
Offline
Offline
Kdgt500.....2 questions.
Whats your budget?
How do you intend to use the car?
Offline
Those heads retail for like $1,500 through Summit, so the price is good. The intake runner is a bit big for a mild build. On a 302 these would be a bit big unless you are shooting for 350HP or more and will cam accordingly. These would work well on a stroker or 351 shooting for 350-450HP.
BUT, at 70cc the chambers are way too big. The problem with a 302 is that the stroke is too short to get a reasonable compression ratio with normally sized chambers. With a 70cc chamber you're going to be about 8:1 with a flat top piston, the piston 0.010" down in the hole, and a 0.030" compressed HG thickness. If you went to a 58cc chamber, which is about the smallest I've seen on a production aftermarket head you still only get to 9.3:1 all things remaining constant. You'd have to get to 50cc to get 10:1 from that 302. You could run a thin HG, but then you lose your quench distance and probably have to worry about the piston smacking the head. I won't build an engine that doesn't have 0.040" quench distance; it just isn't safe. The best bet would be to mill the heads about 0.090" to get to a 50cc chamber, and then you'd need to mill the intake like 0.200" on the head sides and 0.286" on the bottom to regain proper fitment. You also would need to check PTV clearance to use a performance cam ground for use with that 10:1 compression ratio. You can cut the valve reliefs in the pistons deeper without pulling the pistons, but its a time intensive proposition (bolt and unbolt the head 4 times per side).
Offline
Thanks guys for suggestions. I haven't realized that performance cast heads are as much as aluminum now. I wasn't wanting to spend a bunch of money on this because I'm building a stroker engine for this car and already have a set of trick flows purchased for that project. I was just wanting a mild fix to this issue right now. I'm just going to use reman heads so I can drive the car right now until I build my stroker. I had back on the road for three days when I had a valve get bent on me. I had just put new front suspension and a Shelby drop on it. Took it to local machine shop and found out that It was going to need new valves guides.
Offline
Be wary of different water port configurations on 5.0 vs 289/302 blocks. Heads need to match the block.
REMEMBER!!! When posting a question about your Mustang or other Ford on this forum, BE SURE to tell us what it is, what year, engine, etc so we have enough information to go on. |