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i have a 1980 302 in my 65 coupe i need a water pump with the inlet on the driver side. but can someone explain to me if i need a clockwise or counter clockwise pump. summit has both pumps for a 1980 302.
help i am confused.
thanks
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Standard rotation, clockwise, pumps are generally used with V-belts.
Anti clockwise, with serpentine drive.
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You can use either pump on the engine, you just have to match the pump to the accessory drive belt style as 50vert noted.
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I thought if you got a reverse rotating water pump you had to change the timing chain cover to match the water pump.???
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HudginJ3 wrote:
I thought if you got a reverse rotating water pump you had to change the timing chain cover to match the water pump.???
No, as long as the pump will bolt on to the cover regardless of rotation you're good to go. A word of caution, as was mentioned as far as the pulleys and brackets must all match. In 1970 Ford changed to the lower hose on the driver's side, a 4 bolt pulley on the harmonic balancer and the timing marks in a different location. This must all match. Timing covers up to 67 had a cast on timing mark and don't lend themselves to the 70 and later pulley arrangement. The front timing chain covers were made to be universal with bolt on timing pointers and these can be retrofitted with the appropriate bolt on timing pointer
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It is always advisable whenever you make a change that you verify that TDC on your balancer and pointer is actually TDC #1 cylinder. All told Ford used at least three different positions over the years, and mix and match will have your timing WAY off. There are adjustable pointers available, but these will only allow slight variation. It won't allow you to change say a 10 o'clock balancer into an 11 o'clock balancer. They only allow fine tuning within a limited range to make sure the pointer and TDC mark are perfectly aligned.
I've noticed that the balance of the engine and the pointer location may be interconnected. Fox era 5.0s used a 50 oz imbalance, whereas earlier engines used a 28 oz. imbalance. A lot of stroker kits used in the 5.0 go back to the 28 oz. imbalance because it makes balancing the assembly easier. BUT, the Fox era 5.0 used a 50 oz imbalance balancer with an 11 o'clock timing pointer. I've found that the 28 oz. balancer uses a 10 o'clock pointer. That seemingly minor difference will have your timing 30 degrees off if you don't catch it. The earlier cars used a pointer at the 2 o'clock position, which is on the opposite (left) side of the engine and would be even worse; it probably wouldn't even run if you mixed those up. Like most things assumption here gets you in hot water quick. Ford built very similar small block engines for decades, but the devil, as always, is in the differences; not the similarities.
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If you are replacing an existing pump that was hooked up and working, all you need to know is if you have a serpentine belt where the SMOOTH side of the belt turns the pump, then you need a reverse rotation pump. If you have a v-belt or even a serpentine type belt, but the grooved side of the belt turns the pump, then you need standard rotation.
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HudginJ3 wrote:
I thought if you got a reverse rotating water pump you had to change the timing chain cover to match the water pump.???
I may be wrong, but I think if you go with a serpentine set-up you have to also change the timing cover. If you compare the inlet and outlet passages on the back of each cover, you will see that the flow of coolant is different between each system. I had to change mine when I went to the serpentine set-up. Been wrong before.
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It seems the covers are slightly different, but I've heard that so long as you use the correct water pump backing plate it doesn't matter. Of course I've also heard that a mismatch can cause overheating. I'd ere on the side of caution and match the cover to the pump. A new cover is available for either application (some I think may also be universal), and aren't terribly expensive.
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I've read and seen pictures someplace of the "ramps" for the inlet and outlet of the timing cover being different based on the rotation of the pump. That is why I brought this up. That is why you can't just change the rotation or just get any pump you want....????
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If you look at the covers side by side there are two apparent differences as it pertains to the water pump. The first is that there is an additional bolt hole on the early style timing covers. I can't say the result from simply not using the hole if installing the later style pump without it. I would think it wouldn't be an issue because Ford clearly thought it wasn't necessary when they deleted it on the later covers and pumps. Otherwise the bolt pattern is the same.
The second difference is the ramps going into the water ports are in different orientations between the two covers. BUT, this is where I think the back cover of the water pump makes the difference because the holes in those covers are simple circles. The water flow path through the engine is the same for all Ford small blocks. So long as the circles on the pump cover and the ports in the timing cover line up and nothing is occluded I don't see why it wouldn't work. However, I can't say if that is the case or not for certain. I would say that if you were contemplating using a RR pump on an early cover I would advise taking the back plate off the pump and lining it up with the bolt holes on the timing cover and checking the water passages. If there's no restriction created by the match I would expect it to cool just fine. If there is a restriction I'd swap the timing cover to the later style to avoid a possible reduction in water flow and potential accompanying cooling issues.
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