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  •  » FYI Ford, Classic Mustang Tech Discussion
  •  » timing

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    8/24/2022 11:53 AM  #1

    Steve69
    Senior 24-7 FYI Addict

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    From: Madison Wisconsin
    Registered: 4/01/2013
    Posts: 2,735

    timing

    Hey Guys,

    Always had issues with my engine running hot at idle.  Its the original 302 that was rebuilt 30 over back about 30 years ago.  I've flushed out the engine block ran different water pumps and still runs hot.  I added a electric fan which has helped some many years ago.  The main reason why I dont drive it a lot.  On the hwy it will run 180 usually no problems.  If I take corner or slow down it creeps up until Im back up to hwy speed.  At idle the electric fans can keep it at 200 to 210.  The engine itself runs good..  

    So Sunday I read through some of the older FIA posts and I thought I would try to time the engine  with a vacuum gauge. Took it out for a spin to warm it up.  I checked the summit racing manual for the correct vacuum timing port on the summit racing carburetor.   I installed the gauge and advanced the timing to the highest vacuum and idle which was 15 pounds.  I backed it down 1 pound to 14 pounds and tightened it down.  I marked the distributor prior to moving and it did advance some.   

    The engine ran good and didn't ping and idled smooth.

    So I let it idle and see if it might help the engine running hot.  It was about the same.  As it idles the engine runs rough under 1000 rpms and slowly dies. Wont hold the idle.  I needed to hit the gas pedal to keep it running below 1000 rpms.  In the past I would just keep set at 1000 rpms at idle.  When the AC compressor would kick on Id have to hit the gas pedal to keep it running.   Do you think my fuel is boiling causing a vapor lock?  I do run Premium no ethanol fuel.  The fuel lines are run away from engine except for when they go to the carburetor.  I think it might have some internal issues and what's causing it to run hot at idle. 

    Thanks for the info!
    Steve69
      

     

    8/24/2022 12:17 PM  #2

    6sally6
    Hyper FYIFORD ADDICT

    Offline

    From: Surfside Beach,SC
    Registered: 4/02/2013
    Posts: 6,852

    Re: timing

    What's the timing light say?!
    IF you haven't done the total timing thing with the tape and light weights and total timing limiter........you CAN try this.
    Advance the initial some more and drive it. Put it under a load to see if it rattles. If not advance it until it DOES.
       THEN.....back the timing off a couple degrees until it stops. (Make sure it cranks OK when the engines hot)
    That should be your max setting as far as timing goes.
       THEN tune that carb.
    Screw both mixture screws in until they seat (gently!) screw them both out approx. 2 full turns.
    Using vacuum gauge  get the highest vacuum setting at 1000 RPM idle.
    Turn the curb idle screw down to get about 750 RPM.
    Unless you have a radical camshaft 750-800RPM is about right.
    IF ya need to idle it at 1000 RPM I believe you're just compensating for a bigger problem.
    Butt-hay...........all cars are different and different things work best on them.
    This is my recipe.....
    6sally6

    Get busy Liv'in or get busy Die'n....Host of the 2020 Bash at the Beach/The only Bash that got cancelled  )8
     

    8/24/2022 2:28 PM  #3

    Nos681
    Senior 24-7 FYI Addict

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    From: Atlantic Mine, Michigan
    Registered: 7/14/2016
    Posts: 3,329

    Re: timing

    How old is carb?
    How long has it been sitting?
    Has it been rebuilt?

    Back in ‘09, I was getting mine ready for the road again.

    After being a garage queen…fool better describes it…I had it running really swell for 2 days.
    Literally while idling in the garage as my son and I were standing there thinking we’re done….it acted up to the point it would  want to die at idle.

    I checked everything, including inside the tank, pick up screen, blowing out the hardline in both directions after allowing degreaser to sit for an hour  (couple of times), replaced filter and mechanical pump out and fuel line to the carb as well as sending unit hose to hard line.

    Improved a little, still not right after checking and cleaning.

    I finally removed the carb top plate (Edelbrock) and saw my problem.

    Varnish had sloughed off the walls and was plugging up passages. I was able to disassemble and clean out without a rebuild kit and it was back to normal again.

    I just made (temporary) notes of all screw adjustments as I disassembled and it went well.

    Important note, there’s a check ball in there and I almost lost it in the gravel driveway.  Thank goodness for grass growing at end of concrete garage floor….I learned a valuable lesson that day.

    If you have a Holley, I would inspect the front bowl first.

    Hopefully it’s something simple.

    Is the throttle plate adjusted correctly?
    I’m still learning about Holley’s.

    Last edited by Nos681 (8/24/2022 2:30 PM)

     

    8/24/2022 4:12 PM  #4

    MS
    Forum Originator

    Offline

    From: Canyon Lake, Texas
    Registered: 1/24/2013
    Posts: 12,246

    Re: timing

    I agree with sal.
    Sounds like you might have a vacuum leak. Clamp pcv hose shut and see if it changes. Too much advance can cause idle issues, also.
    You can use a spray can of starting ether to find vacuum leaks just spray at any suspect area.  If engine speeds up you found a leak.  Be sure the ether is not just entering the too of the carb.

    That Summit carb is a good one. You might need to clean it out if crudded up, though

    Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     

    8/25/2022 9:12 AM  #5

    Steve69
    Senior 24-7 FYI Addict

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    From: Madison Wisconsin
    Registered: 4/01/2013
    Posts: 2,735

    Re: timing

    Thanks guys for the help.  I take another look at this weekend.  The carburetor is a few years old.  I wouldn't think it would be gummed up yet.   When I step on it there's no bog or hesitation.   Just the idle down engine running rough and then die.  Ill check for vacuum leaks too.

    Thanks
    Steve69

       •Thread Starter
     

    8/26/2022 8:43 AM  #6

    MS
    Forum Originator

    Offline

    From: Canyon Lake, Texas
    Registered: 1/24/2013
    Posts: 12,246

    Re: timing

    I’d start by turning the distributor at idle until it idles smooth without dying. Don’t worry about the numbers until you get it running right.

    Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     

    8/26/2022 8:46 AM  #7

    Steve69
    Senior 24-7 FYI Addict

    Offline

    From: Madison Wisconsin
    Registered: 4/01/2013
    Posts: 2,735

    Re: timing

    MS wrote:

    I’d start by turning the distributor at idle until it idles smooth without dying. Don’t worry about the numbers until you get it running right.

      Thats a good idea too!  Thanks!
     

       •Thread Starter
     

     

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