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  •  » Idler arm bracket?

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    4/06/2014 10:00 AM  #1

    boomyal
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    From: Vancouver, Washington
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    Idler arm bracket?

    My question is, is the idler arm bracket for the V8 Power Steering and the V8 Manual Steering one and the same?  What I do know is that the raw castings on the bracket end of the idler arms are of different heights.  On the Power Idler arm, the bracket end has to be machined down to accept a roller bearing bushing.

    Whereas, for the Manual Steering idler arm you can buy a bearing set and install it without machining.  I am assuming that the same thing goes for the Manual quick steer idler arm.

    This then begs my original question as to whether either Manual idler arm (stock or quick) will fit on the bracket that came on a factory power steering car?

     

    4/08/2014 6:40 PM  #2

    boomyal
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    Re: Idler arm bracket?

    Hopefully, someone knows the answer to my question?

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    4/09/2014 6:09 AM  #3

    John Ha
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    From: Mitchell, SD
    Registered: 4/02/2013
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    Re: Idler arm bracket?

    I looked this up in the MPC.  There's one part number for the 65-66 Mustang idler arm bracket listed (C3DZ 3341-A).   There are different kits (bracket, arm, bushing, etc.) for the V-8, 6-cylinder, power steering and manual steering though.  I've attached a screen grab (Mustang is model "F") FYI.

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    4/09/2014 7:13 PM  #4

    boomyal
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    Re: Idler arm bracket?

    Not sure I can decipher that John, but it looks like one bracket for all V8's.  I do know that 6 cyl's used an entirely different style bracket.  Not sure if there was any difference between 6 cyl manual and 6 cyl power steering, but my concern was for the V8.

    Not sure what the model F is all about.

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    4/09/2014 8:11 PM  #5

    josh-kebob
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    Re: Idler arm bracket?

    This is the answer to your question:

    The bracket for 65-66 V-8's is the same for manual or power steering....
    Part number C3DZ-3551-A

     

    4/09/2014 8:59 PM  #6

    boomyal
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    Re: Idler arm bracket?

    josh-kebob wrote:

    This is the answer to your question:

    The bracket for 65-66 V-8's is the same for manual or power steering....
    Part number C3DZ-3551-A

    Settles that!  Thanks Josh-
     

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    4/09/2014 9:21 PM  #7

    Bullet Bob
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    Re: Idler arm bracket?

    Butt...(TS&T), I presume you are aware that the bushing in the PS arm is not supposed to turn on the shaft (bracket) nor is it supposed to turn in the idler arm.  It is supposed to be pressed tight into the arm and locked down with the nut to the bracket, hence the little "teeth" on the inner bushing liner.  It has a thicker rubber bushing which actually twists when you turn.  The purpose of this is to help return to center with the original PS system.

    I had read this soom years ago in a volume that was, I thought, less than reliable.  After removing the first PS arm I was able to find because it couldn't be made to turn by hand, and putting on a manual one, I learned the error of my ways.

    So If you have stock PS, or even a Borgeson, you may not want to do anything...like a roller bearing bushing...to make the arm turn easy.   Just sayin'.

    BB

    Last edited by Bullet Bob (4/09/2014 9:23 PM)

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    4/09/2014 10:54 PM  #8

    boomyal
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    Re: Idler arm bracket?

    Yeah, BB, I am aware of the 'return to center' feature of the rubber bushing.  I have also seen the little teeth that you mention although I was not aware of their function.  Suffice it to say that I did replace my stock idler arm with a roller bearing arm and with a high castor alignment, did not notice any negative effect in my steering's return to center.

    My whole objective here, is to reduce the excessive reeling in of the steering wheel, in typical intersection manuvering.  IMO, the power steering is more than adequate to handle the increased effort created by the Quick Steer components. 

    My concerns have been twofold. One is that the increased pitman and idler arm length would produce a comfortable tightening of the turn radius and Two, is that all the componets would be in harmony when they are installed.

    ....but glad you brought up the little teeth on the bushing.  I never even wondered whey they were there.

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    4/10/2014 2:36 PM  #9

    John Ha
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    From: Mitchell, SD
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    Re: Idler arm bracket?

    josh-kebob wrote:

    This is the answer to your question:
    The bracket for 65-66 V-8's is the same for manual or power steering....
    Part number C3DZ-3551-A

    That is what I tried to say in my post.  I need to learn to communicate better.  Sigh - sorry!

    boomyal wrote:

     My concerns have been twofold. One is that the increased pitman and idler arm length would produce a comfortable tightening of the turn radius ...

    I'm not sure that I understand your statement correctly.  To clarify, the longer pitman and idler arms don't reduce the turn radius of the car.  The steering stops will ensure that the road wheels turn the same maximum amount regardless of what pitman/idler arm you have.  The longer arms do increase the amount of angular motion at the spindles for a given amount of steering wheel motion though, so your steering linkage will move a given distance with a smaller angular steering wheel input.

    Did that make sense?

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    4/10/2014 4:30 PM  #10

    boomyal
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    Re: Idler arm bracket?

    What you said, JH, is exactly what I meant.  Taking all the hardware and the antique geometry into account, it seems that  you could tighten up that ratio to the point where it is not friendly.  That's all I was saying.

    I would hate to go thru all the motions, to make sure everything worked mechanically only to find that I created a hyper sensitive, uncomfortable result.  After all, my quest would be compounding the effects of a fast ratio steering box (factory power steering) with fast ratio pitman and idler arms.  As you know, the Quick Steer arms were initially engineered to complement  the lower gear ratio of the manual steering box.  

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