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4/25/2014 6:44 PM  #1


Gettin' DIRTY!

I've been hard at work tearing down my old '67 Cougar!   When I say that the old wiring is a rat's nest, I really mean it; you would not believe the size of some of the droppings up there under my intake.  It could've been a small dog, I guess. ;)

If I remember right, BB had a neat trick for turning around the upper intake and using a more 'stock' linkage.  Could sure use any info you can share on how to make that work well!

Also, what pros/cons are there to removing all the EGR junk?  This old tin cat doesn't have cats, or thermactor, or smog pumps.  

You would not believe how long it took to get the pins out that hold those vacuum actuators for my headlights in place.  Ever cajole a little metal bit under a car for 3 hours with no success and no breaks?  Good fun there!  (Converting to electric headlight door actuators)  

Here are some pics of what I've been up to!  






 


"Whatever you are, be a good one." - Abraham Lincoln
 

4/25/2014 9:15 PM  #2


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

Wow...looks like it got a little warm under there Techno. 

As for turning the intake around it's not too tough if you have access to a light duty welder, or if you ain't into performace you can use the TB from a pre 91 CV, TC or Merc.  Those were "Standard" 5.0's and had a smaller TB than the HO.  I ran ours for a  couple of years with one.  Just  won't give you all the HO is capable of.

The upper intake don't care which way you mount it.  If you are going to run EGR you will also need to get the EGR block from the CV, TC or Merc.  Problem here  is that those EGR blocks are smaller ID than the HO EGR block so it would tend to choke things down a bit.  Butt (TS&T) if you use the smaller CR/TC throttle body it won't matter.  Most guys pitch the EGR and for your right-to-left swap that makes sense...mostly why I did.  But there is no performance advantage to getting rid of EGR.  In fact, there is some evidence that fuel economy will suffer slightly.  Just sayin'. 
Look on line for EGR removal plates.  DO NOT just get a plate to cover the EGR contol valve opening in the EGR block.  You want a full plate that replaces the EGR block on the upper intake.

If you have an AOD you can bone-yard the brackets and cable from a CV or TC but you'll need to do a little fabricating to mount the  TB end of the cable. You can probably rig something off of the plate you got to remove the EGR block.  If you have a manual tranny, no worry. 

The throttle linkage is duck soup.  You can probably just make a new throttle rod with a bit more dog-leg in it to line up with the TB.  Or, you may need to cut off the vertical piece on the right side of the bell-crank and weld it to the top of the piece that goes inside for the pedal.  I did mine that way but when I went to the Explorer intake (thank you Corky) and pitched the EGR, I moved it back, I think...haven't seen it in over a year.

Now, the left handed HO throttle body requires a little massaging.  Get the TB from the CV, TC, etc and compare it to the HO TB.  You'll notice that the business ends of the throttle arm are reversed.  Again if you have an AOD you'll need to cut one end off the CV unit and cut and weld it to the HO unit.  If you have a manual you just need install  a linkage ball at the oposite end of the arm.  You can probably cut and weld one or buy a replacement with a threaded shank and mount that.  I don't recall all the details of  the TB conversion but I'll be happy to send  you a picture or two if you shoot an email.

Other that that, it looks like you're going to have  re-wrap that harness.

What happened anyway?  Other than extreme overheating.  Was it your's when it burned or did you buy it that way?   Maybe I just don't recall your posts about this near disaster.

Good luck, I hope some of this makes sense.

BB

 


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

4/26/2014 4:41 AM  #3


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

Can't help to notice the rods you have from the shock towers to the firewall/cowl. As they are designed right now they are almost pointless as the heim joints makes it possible for them to move up and down which misses the whole point of trying to make a solid triangulated re-inforcement. I know that several vendors sells braces of a similar design, but they are also more or less pointless as if you wanna make something solid you do not use flexible joints in the design.

 

4/26/2014 6:56 AM  #4


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

Hakan wrote:

Can't help to notice the rods you have from the shock towers to the firewall/cowl. As they are designed right now they are almost pointless as the heim joints makes it possible for them to move up and down which misses the whole point of trying to make a solid triangulated re-inforcement. I know that several vendors sells braces of a similar design, but they are also more or less pointless as if you wanna make something solid you do not use flexible joints in the design.

HA! agree I always laugh when I see those on cars. Kinda like ah wing on the BACK, of ah FRONT,wheel drive car

Last edited by Derek (4/26/2014 6:58 AM)


It's hard to type "funny"
 

4/26/2014 10:00 AM  #5


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

Derek wrote:

Hakan wrote:

Can't help to notice the rods you have from the shock towers to the firewall/cowl. As they are designed right now they are almost pointless as the heim joints makes it possible for them to move up and down which misses the whole point of trying to make a solid triangulated re-inforcement. I know that several vendors sells braces of a similar design, but they are also more or less pointless as if you wanna make something solid you do not use flexible joints in the design.

HA! agree I always laugh when I see those on cars. Kinda like ah wing on the BACK, of ah FRONT,wheel drive car

 
Oh, you mean like on the new VWBeetles that are front drive and have an automatically deploying rear spoiler? If you look closely you will see that the body shape is an airfoil which lifts the car at speed, so the rear spoiler provides downforce for the whole car above 90 mph. There is enough track data to know that if you stuff a big enough motor into a stock vintage VW body to get it up to 168 mph, the aerodynamic forces will lift the rear end enough for the wind resistance to push the front end underneath the rear. Makes for a spectacular crash.  Just like the fins on a 59 Ch*** would lift the rear end off the ground at 120 mph. Aerodynamics are tricky. Now back to our regularly scheduled thread.

 

4/26/2014 10:27 AM  #6


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

Hakan wrote:

Can't help to notice the rods you have from the shock towers to the firewall/cowl. As they are designed right now they are almost pointless as the heim joints makes it possible for them to move up and down which misses the whole point of trying to make a solid triangulated re-inforcement. I know that several vendors sells braces of a similar design, but they are also more or less pointless as if you wanna make something solid you do not use flexible joints in the design.

 
Hmm, the "Heim-ended brace" topic is almost as fiercely debated as the "Thermostat or no thermostat" topic. The counterpoint to Hakan's arguement would be that an export brace is stamped sheetmetal bolted to stamped sheetmetal. How stiff can that be? The Heim proponents will point out that the point of the braces is to maintain set distances between two reference points (the Heim mounting points), not to keep everything rigidly in place in all planes. The firewall to shocktower brace is intended to keep the shocktowers from flexing inward and a Monte Carlo brace is intended to keep the shocktowers a constant distance apart. Does adding a Heim at the attachment points materially change the way the braces work? I confess that I don't really know. I personally think the Heim ended braces look cool. It is interesting that Ford chose to add a set of tubular braces from the firewall to the front of the fenders on the convertibles rather than a Monte Carlo type bar.

With as many members as we have from many varied backgrounds, surely we have someone with access to finite element analysis that can model the two systems and at least give us some rough answers.

 

4/26/2014 11:48 AM  #7


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

Sorry for highjacking this thread...

Discussing and debating is one thing, but this is how I re-inforced the cowl to the shocktowers on my '67, first there's a rectangular 1"x1" piece of tubing under the cowl "lip" also connecting the two sides together and as can be seen I also extended the firewall on the passenger side to connect to it:


To connect the torque box, door post, rocker panel and a-pillar area to the shock tower I made this:






Here's my export brace that will be bolted to the rest of the design using 10 M10 bolts, as can bee seen I used some material from an original export brace, but tried to make it more solid using tubing and extra material. I BTW do not plan to use a monte carlo bar as I think all this will be enough:


Would be cool to see what others have done to improve the same thing I've been trying to improve.

IMHO using heim joints, no matter how cool they look in a design that is supposed to be solid is the wrong application of the heim joint as such.



 

 

4/26/2014 12:24 PM  #8


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

A heim joint can be engineered to make a perfectly rigid connection, but NOT when it has a little lever arm attached to it that lets it pivot by bending the sheetmetal it is attached to,

As for export braces.  There are two types.  Original Shelby type and aftermarket junk.  The aftermarket shallow stamped ones can be twisted quite easily by hand, where the ones with the deep stamping creating vertical ridges are very strong.

As for the Cougar fire...  Glad you are finally getting time to get to work on your car. Fires are not pretty unless in a fireplace.


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
 

4/26/2014 12:45 PM  #9


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

I appreciate the tip about my brace!   Never liked it anyway - only put it in because I didn't know of a good solution that would clear my 5.0 airbox.  What would you guys suggest in its place?

Potentially, you have just saved me some painting!  ;)

(Like that's the greatest problem I face in this rebuild.  HA!)

Seriously though, since a normal export brace (or even the flimsy stock sheetmetal braces) won't clear that upper intake, I'll have to come up with something...


"Whatever you are, be a good one." - Abraham Lincoln
     Thread Starter
 

4/26/2014 12:55 PM  #10


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

And Bob - I have a stock 5.0 HO upper intake with mass air, all that good stuff.   '89 unit.  She's still got her C4, and will keep it until I can afford new rear gears to replace my 2.79 cogs in the back.  

At some point I hope to get a 4r70W transmission, and better gears, just skipping all the baloney with those tv cables for the AOD, going straight to the baloney of more electronics in my old car.

My motor came out of a Lincoln sport coupe, and although there are some very *minor* differences from the Mustang's HO motor, it's pretty close.  The engine itself is actually a remanufactured 5.0 HO (306 now) from who-knows-what.  It's got a 100k mile warranty on it, with only 3k before the engine fire happened.


"Whatever you are, be a good one." - Abraham Lincoln
     Thread Starter
 

4/26/2014 2:05 PM  #11


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

Sorry Technomancer for extending the hijack of your thread. I really do like Cougars and I look forward to seeing your vision for the old girl.

 

4/26/2014 2:31 PM  #12


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

Thanks, Hornman.

And while I'm talking, just want to say you guys are the best.  It does me good to know that there are people like me, unafraid to tear into their classic cars and make them into something potentially better - or at least different, in a way that makes us happy.

Hakaan, I never have words to describe what I think about your work.  It really makes me wish I knew how to weld.  All I can say is that I sure can't wait to see her when you get it done.  


"Whatever you are, be a good one." - Abraham Lincoln
     Thread Starter
 

4/26/2014 3:47 PM  #13


Re: Gettin' DIRTY!

Technomancer wrote:

Hakaan, I never have words to describe what I think about your work.  It really makes me wish I knew how to weld.  All I can say is that I sure can't wait to see her when you get it done.

Many thanks! I just wish I had more time to work on it.

 

 

Board footera


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