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5/25/2014 5:23 AM  #1


57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

I need a drivers side axle for my non stock rear end It is 5 on 4.5 and 28 spline.
Can i buy something esle to fit it and what measurments will i need to know as far as brake offset and length.I belive my brake setup is of a lincoln MK7 but all my notes are at work today.
Yeay its a messed up setup but i am just trying to make it work.
Thanks
Terry

 

 

5/25/2014 7:23 AM  #2


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

So what happened to your axle?  Assuming you have the 9" 57-59?  Here's some info I found helpful when rebuilding my 9":  http://www.ultrastang.com/info1.php  Some considerations:

Not sure if bearings can be interchanged (maybe someone can chime in) but if not, is this a medium or large bearing bearing axle? 

According to the above article, this housing is the same width as the 65-66 Mustang 8" housings (guess that's why you're using it).  Apparently some 8" 28 spline axles can also be used (http://www.maliburacing.com/ford_9_inch/ford_nine_inch.htm) so if the bearing is not an issue you may be able to use the 65-66 8" axles.  Also, apparently some later 28 spline axles are not necked-down and can be shortened and resplined.


Cheap, Fast, Good:  Pick Any Two
 

5/25/2014 8:44 AM  #3


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

I have two sets of 57-59 28-spline axels, one set w/small bearings (2.835" OD), and one set w/large bearing (3.15" OD).  Both are the stock lengths and are 5 lug on 4.5" bolt circle.
Send me a PM, I'm sure we can work something out.


65 Fastback, 351W, 5-speed, 4 wheel discs, 9" rear,  R&C Front End.
 

5/25/2014 11:19 AM  #4


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

I think i have two issues one for sure is the spline is twisted.and two I have runout on the outer side of the bearing causing The wheel flange,the rotor and the wheel and tire assembly to waooble alot.I switces wheel and tire assemblies to verify it is not the wheel.I did my testing while on jacktands in 4th front wheels chocked and nothing in front of the car and ran it up to 60-70 mph and the vibration wobble got worse.Not sure if this is mu sole vibration issue but it needs to be fixed and i hope it is my vibration.
I will try and load some pics now.The od of my bearing is 2.837" and the od of the axle where the bearing goes is 1.365" .
The holes in the housing flange are 3/8" diameter which also signifies it is not the large bearing housing.
Where do i measure to determine the brake offset that i have read about.It setermines where in my case the brake rotor sits in relation to my brake calipers.I say someone modded these brakes before the brackets and such were available form some of the vendors.I have read all the stuff from ultrastang and it is a great help.I think I have a 57 housing with medium size bearings if that makes sense.What vehicles had this setup.I spent hrs on line try to figure this out...Bob You have pm with my e-mail in it.

Last edited by Terry M (5/25/2014 11:29 AM)

     Thread Starter
 

5/25/2014 11:22 AM  #5


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

jkordzi,
I believe the axle was twisted and bent when i bought the car 2 years ago and am now figuring it out since i have been restoring the car and deperately try to get som milles on it but the gremlins are winning.

     Thread Starter
 

6/04/2014 6:56 PM  #6


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

I think the axle i had in my car is possibly a 31 spline from a newer car than mine that has been cut/turned down and then re-splined.I say this because of the machining marks on the end of the axle and the axle is not tapered like other 28 spline i have seen and the larger register for the brakes that steve has mentioned.

     Thread Starter
 

6/04/2014 9:42 PM  #7


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

Deja Vu! i have the same housing in my pro-street mustang and had about the same problem. got some nice splined paperweights from it.
if any deal with BobE can't work out (i'm assuming not, or you wouldn't be back to this thread) i'd contact Moser Engineering for some custom axles. I'd bet my last 5 bucks that housing has been narrowed and you'll have a hard time finding a stock axle to fit. can't think of anything from the 50's that wouldn't have to be narrowed to get under a mustang. what width is it axle flange to axle flange? 57 1/4"? if it is, you can find an axle from a 9" 65-66, but that's probably gonna be real hard to come by.

when mine snapped, i tried Currie in So-Cal first, since they were semi-local, but they got really wierd when i told them i was using 8 3/4" mopar ends on my 9" ford. Moser had no problem and i had a new set of axles within two weeks. (this was 15 years ago) i don't know what you have for a center section now, but if there's nothing special about it, i'd seriously think about upgrading to a 31 spline while you're at it. i sure wish i had. i was only saving about $175 bucks for the spool at the time.

28 or 31 spline axles are the same price. $370http://www.moserengineering.com/custom-alloy-28-spline-axles.html http://www.moserengineering.com/custom-alloy-31-spline-axles.html
i'll include Currie's links as well, even though i don't like them. (wouldn't be fair to you to leave them out just because i still hold a grudge.)http://currieenterprises2.reachlocal.net/cestore/Product596.aspx?id=1885
http://currieenterprises2.reachlocal.net/cestore/Product596.aspx?id=1463
you can buy a single axle at Currie (the second link) if you go that route, i'd still contact Moser and ask them about a single axle first. (those Currie guys must have really let me down, to harbor ill-will for so long. i probably missed a big race waiting on them.)

here's a nice rear-end width chart so you'll see the right size axles will be slim pickings for sure.http://www.carnut.com/specs/rear.html

edit... are these for your show car? i was thinking 65-66 for some reason. (probably cause that's what i threw mine under) if it's the 69-70, you'll have an even harder time. @60" it'll probably be a 67 Cougar or 58-60 Edsel you'll be looking for.  

Last edited by R5CYA (6/04/2014 10:17 PM)

 

6/05/2014 9:41 AM  #8


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

I came back as an fyi and to share some more info from my findings.I am pretty confident my housing is from a 57 ford and because it measures 57-1/4" form rear of axle flange to rear of axle flange and it has the band in the center and ultrastang feels they are out oof said car as well.I had a axle here from a 57-59 ford and I measured everything up and it slid in and the bearing bottomed out in the housing perfectly So i am confident in what my housing is.My 3rd member is traction lock with 28 spline and 325 gears and i have another Nodular 3rd member here with 486 gears in it .
This is the setup in my brandywine 70 mach 1.Thanks

     Thread Starter
 

6/05/2014 10:07 AM  #9


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

Just for my own curiosity, can you post a couple of photos of the N case? One photo looking straight onto the face of the 3rd member and one from the side.

 

6/05/2014 10:20 AM  #10


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

you need to measure from flange to flange on the outside, where the drum or rotor sits. is that where you got your measurement?

 

6/05/2014 11:05 AM  #11


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

R5CYA
Where the drum rotor would sit to where the other drum rotor would sit is not you axle housing width.The axle housing width is from flange to flange .I figured out the correct way to measure this on ultrastangs website and he has done alot of research.
Here are pics of the N case.It would not surprise me if it was messed up as it came with the car and many other items were messed up.
 

     Thread Starter
 

6/05/2014 12:09 PM  #12


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

i haven't looked at ultrastang's site to see his info, but i doubt it's any different than any others. maybe the problem came about when i first asked about how wide your rear was. i asked about axle flange to axle flange width. there is a big difference between housing width and axle flange to axle flange. all the measurements in the link i provided to you earlier are axle flange to axle flange. this can only be measured on a rear end with axles installed. pretty much any rear end you look for on the net, is measured this way.
the housing width is measured with the axles out. when it's a bare housing. these numbers don't help when looking for an axle to fit. you can do the math to figure out what axle you need this way, but it's a real headache. i'll post a pdf of rear end measurements for you, then i'll have a look at ultrasatngs and compare. hope this helps. untill we get the correct width straightened out between us, it'll be hard for anyone to help find the axle. sorry if i seem rude with this post, if it comes off that way, i apologize. it's not intended to be.
http://completeoffroad.com/files/how_to_measure_ford_9_axles.pdf
is this the article at ultrastang you were reffering to? http://ultrastang.com/info1.php

 

Last edited by R5CYA (6/05/2014 12:24 PM)

 

6/05/2014 1:00 PM  #13


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

Terry M wrote:

R5CYA
Where the drum rotor would sit to where the other drum rotor would sit is not you axle housing width.The axle housing width is from flange to flange .I figured out the correct way to measure this on ultrastangs website and he has done alot of research.
Here are pics of the N case.It would not surprise me if it was messed up as it came with the car and many other items were messed up.
 

 
The good news is the 3rd member is in fact a factory N case. The better news is it's the best version of the factory N case that you can get. --the Daytona version. You can tell this by the 5 - bolt driving pinion bearing housing on the front. It's the same 3/8" thickness all the way around. The non - Daytona N case would have raised bosses under each of the 5-bolt heads, like would be found on any other 9-inch 3rd member.

The factory N cases, before 1970, didn't have the large "N" cast between the ribs. This makes it easy for people to pass off the old WAA, WAB or WAR castings to people who don't know what to look for. The curvature of the horizontal ribs at the ends are different and an N case won't have depressions beneath these ribs.

In regards to housing width/wheel flange width; I list various housing widths on my site with the notation that this is bare housing with. As a general rule of thumb, housing end flange to wheel flange offset is 2.5" per side. Collectively, if you add 5", overall, to the bare housing width (the approximate thickness of each drum brake assembly), then this will give you the wheel flange to wheel flange measurement. Example: if a '68 Mustang housing width is 54-1/4", the overall wheel flange distance would be 59-1/4" wide.

...we are talking Fords though and we all know not everything is a definite when it comes to Fords. It can vary slightly less to slightly more than 2.5" but, as a general average, the measurement is 2.5" on axle offset sticking out the end of the axle tube. This distance is measured from the very outboard surface of the housing end flange to the wheel mounting surface of the axle flange.

 

6/05/2014 2:34 PM  #14


Re: 57-59 ford "big car" axle needed

Ok on the measuring we'll have to say there is a couple ways to do it and both are correct.What i curently have with the 57 ford axle(well actaully drivers side right now and the other to be changed)  in my 57 ford housing is axle to axle flange width of 61.75 then the thickness of the flange would have to be added as well. prolly 3/16" x2 for a total of  62.125 " if i did my math right you may be right it could be easier to measure axle flange to axle flange .I will do it the next time am down to the rotor is the rear...lol...

I knew that the the axle housing on a 70 mach one was 59.25 and i was loosing 2" with my 57 housing so i went with 1" wheel adapters to gain that back and get be back stock stance.I figured although some do not like adapters it was still my easiest cost effective out.
Once i get to run the car some and experiment I might see what it looks like  wheels/ tires  fit like without the adapters or maybe scale back to 1/2" spacers but we'll see and for now the goal is to get the vibe out and switch the pass side axle out with a mate to the d-side which is from a 57-59 ford.
Currently i have the pass side axle sticking out of the axle falnge about 1/8 farther than the d-side due to the difference in bearing offset between the two mis matched axles.I should have the other axle in next week once i get axle painted and bearing changed out but figured one drive to town won't hurt anything.Car show this sunday.

r5cya
the measurments in this chart are from housing flange to housing flange .I never though you were being rude at all.We just have a couple different ways of doing it.I just wanted to get back to stock measurments so i could use stock 500's with correct backspacing for a period correct look.
http://www.carnut.com/specs/rear.html

Last edited by Terry M (6/05/2014 2:50 PM)

     Thread Starter
 

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