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8/14/2018 2:13 PM  #1


hydraulic lifter preload

I've heard of 1/2 turn and 3/4 turn past zero lash. Any performance differences between the two settings? Thank you in advance.-Brad

 

8/14/2018 4:16 PM  #2


Re: hydraulic lifter preload

From what I understand........NO!

Butt..........1/2 turn  allows lifters to be filled with more oil and act (somewhat like) solid lifters. Which could also mean...if you miss that second-to-third-gear-power-shift...the lifters will float quicker(like floating solid lifters!)
I've even heard of fellas crank'in em all-the-way-down and making a pseudo solid lifter application.
I have mine at 1/2 turn.....so you should too!
6sally6


Get busy Liv'in or get busy Die'n....Host of the 2020 Bash at the Beach/The only Bash that got cancelled  )8
 

8/15/2018 9:13 AM  #3


Re: hydraulic lifter preload

From my understanding the best way to install and set hydraulic preloaded is dry meaning no oil in the lifter. This is the lash you’re trying to set.


I'm not a complete idiot.....pieces are missing. Tom
 

8/15/2018 9:37 AM  #4


Re: hydraulic lifter preload

To add what 6sally6 said about acting like solid lifters. This was actually done for some “stock” classes of the 5.0 wars in drag racing. The hydraulic roller lifters were modified to vaguely work like a hydraulic lifter in name and theory. The plunger’s travel would be severely limited in travel mechanically so there would only be something like a .050” space for oil. The cam lobe and valve springs would be intentionally engineered to go into valve float called “lofting”. Once in valve float it would be basically following a imaginary lobe. So instead of getting the factory.444” lift at the valve, in reality the valve could be opening to .500”. Pretty clever?


I'm not a complete idiot.....pieces are missing. Tom
 

8/15/2018 12:30 PM  #5


Re: hydraulic lifter preload

Tom---The engine is a 347 with Dart Pro 1 heads. Cam is 224/230 @ .050, .556/.513 lift hydraulic. Crower roller rockers. Most suggestions seem to be either 3/4 turn past zero lash or 1/2 turn past zero lash. I believe that the engine builder set them to 1/4 turn if I read his notes correctly. That was 10 years ago, I was attempting to get rid of some perceived valve train noise. I've got them set at 3/4 now and was just wondering what you folks are doing before I button things up. I called Comp Cams this morning and their tech told me that 3/4 turn preload would be fine. 6sally6 uses 1/2 turn. I had already set them to 3/4 when I posted, the confusion for me was after I realized that I had the paper work with the engine and the engine builder set them to 1/4 turn. I haven't fired it up to test yet-Brad

     Thread Starter
 

8/15/2018 1:40 PM  #6


Re: hydraulic lifter preload

BradH wrote:

Tom---The engine is a 347 with Dart Pro 1 heads. Cam is 224/230 @ .050, .556/.513 lift hydraulic. Crower roller rockers. Most suggestions seem to be either 3/4 turn past zero lash or 1/2 turn past zero lash. I believe that the engine builder set them to 1/4 turn if I read his notes correctly. That was 10 years ago, I was attempting to get rid of some perceived valve train noise. I've got them set at 3/4 now and was just wondering what you folks are doing before I button things up. I called Comp Cams this morning and their tech told me that 3/4 turn preload would be fine. 6sally6 uses 1/2 turn. I had already set them to 3/4 when I posted, the confusion for me was after I realized that I had the paper work with the engine and the engine builder set them to 1/4 turn. I haven't fired it up to test yet-Brad

Brad, my comment of the lash being set dry I thought was a interesting comment. I can't say for sure but to me it makes sense as this is the actual gap one is trying to adjust. But anyway I don't think it's absolutely relevant to your question. I agree with what you did, call Cam Cams and get their advice. Now as to the noise, my own limited experience is that generally roller rockers are noisy. I'm a low budget guy. The motor in my 66 is a used GT40P with a used 5.0 cam and used Crane Cobra rockers with Ford part numbers I bought used. They are noisy! Looking into this more on 5.0 boards that has been the consensus, they're noisy but they have past Ford's 100K durability test. I have mid 80's Powered By Ford factory aluminum 5.0 covers on my motor. I had 2 rockers barely touch one of the baffles. You want to talk about noisy? I kid you not but one of the first times I drove the car after getting the motor in I thought I had at least 2 rods waiting to come out of the motor driving around 45 mph. It was that bad. What I understand aluminum rockers no matter what are very noisy and steel rockers are quieter but still noisy. I'm guessing your Crower's are steel? Anyway despite finding a dyno test showing the 1.72 rockers on a stock 5.0 cam are worth about 7 or 8 hp I'm giving thought to putting the stock stamped steel rockers back on. Maybe I'll buy some 351C/351M/400M stamped steel rockers on which are 1.7. I just have to swap the 3/8" trunion for a 5.0 5/16" trunion. these rockers are about $7 a piece.

Here is a clip of my rocker noise. I had removed the fan so that wouldn't add to the noise. After adding another gasket to the covers it make the engine a lot quieter!




 


I'm not a complete idiot.....pieces are missing. Tom
 

8/15/2018 4:42 PM  #7


Re: hydraulic lifter preload

Holy ear ache Tom! Ya sure you had oil in there?   I love your low buck approach.


Bob. 69 Mach 1, 393W, SMOD Toploader, Armstrong  steering, factory AC.
 

8/15/2018 5:16 PM  #8


Re: hydraulic lifter preload

rpm wrote:

Holy ear ache Tom! Ya sure you had oil in there? I love your low buck approach.

Tell me about it! I was ready to pull the motor. Thanks I'm really enjoying at just how cheap and how well this pile runs. I had a new set of GT40P heads I bought years ago for something like $525 or $550 on sale from CJ. Sold them for $525. Bought the GT40P with a trans and all the EFI junk for $450. Sold off what I didn't want for $175. I would do upgrades but it would ruin the whole cheap thing. I mean it runs that good, no plans for aftermarket heads.
 


I'm not a complete idiot.....pieces are missing. Tom
 

8/15/2018 8:20 PM  #9


Re: hydraulic lifter preload

Tom, That is exactly how my engine sounds! I am told that this is normal for the profile of the cam and the associated valve hardware that I am using. I always thought that hydraulic actuated valves were quiet but that is not always the case. Your video and my engine sound like very aggressive solid lifters. I love the sound of solid lifters. I have two other vehicles with HP289's and to me that is music. Incidentally, your posts regarding home brew front end alignments are spot on. I believe that anyone competent enough to work on these cars can be taught to do their own alignment once the basic concepts are understood. I always enjoy reading your posts and that goes for a lot of the other folks out there too. Thanks again.-Brad

     Thread Starter
 

8/15/2018 8:39 PM  #10


Re: hydraulic lifter preload

BradH wrote:

Tom, That is exactly how my engine sounds! I am told that this is normal for the profile of the cam and the associated valve hardware that I am using. I always thought that hydraulic actuated valves were quiet but that is not always the case. Your video and my engine sound like very aggressive solid lifters. I love the sound of solid lifters. I have two other vehicles with HP289's and to me that is music. Incidentally, your posts regarding home brew front end alignments are spot on. I believe that anyone competent enough to work on these cars can be taught to do their own alignment once the basic concepts are understood. I always enjoy reading your posts and that goes for a lot of the other folks out there too. Thanks again.-Brad

Always glad to help. I've had a lot of people help me so I try to pay it forward,. thanks for the kind words. Anyway it's good to put your mind to ease. I use to have a 85 LX 5.0 4V. Awesome running car. It was the first year for the roller cam. That had a bit of a ticking noise to it. After 89 Ford slightly changed the intake ramps to quiet it down. I used 3/8" thick cork Edelbrock VC gaskets from Autozone. They were USA made and like $11 for the pair. Far cheaper then other brands. I had to add a second stock thickness gasket. But yes, roller rockers are going to be a bit noisy evidently.

When I did my suspension I was going to send it out for alignment. I had recently moved to a new state and didn't know any local shops. I was becoming nervous sending it out. I thought to my self, if I just did all this work, why can't I do my own alignment? And why not? Exactly as you said, understand the basics which are very well covered in the Ford shop manual and it's pretty easy to do. The hardest part is just trying.
 


I'm not a complete idiot.....pieces are missing. Tom
 

8/16/2018 12:13 AM  #11


Re: hydraulic lifter preload

Tom, I gotta tag team Brad here on the alignment. Was thinking of mentioning it earlier but didn't want to side track the thread, but since the original question was answered, and Brad brought it up...Your alignment post is the reason I did mine. As I was reading it, I fully agreed with the reasoning to it. When it came to fixing things, one of my dad's favorite lines was, what's the worst thing that can happen? On my 69 at 100 mph, the steering wheel needs no input from me to track straight and true. Thanks for kicking me in the arse to align my own cars.


Bob. 69 Mach 1, 393W, SMOD Toploader, Armstrong  steering, factory AC.
 

Board footera


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