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1/20/2020 6:30 PM  #1


1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

Ok sorry for opening up so many posts so close together, I'm just super motivated and eager to get this car perfect and the way I want her.

I was on the fence converting it to a T5, mostly cause of the $$ it would cost but also cause it is a Nut and Bolt Resto and she runs and drives like a brand new 68 FB. But as of a few hours ago I was informed the make a conversion that Allows me to keep 85% of my toploader/factory setup and just swap out the Transmission itself!!!!?????!!!!

Amazing!

I'm looking for clear and concise help and guidance on what exactly I require to do this !  I want to keep the Z-Bar setup, the new toploader clutch I have and the bellhousing , if possible.
The less invasive this conversion is the happier I will be!

(For example: do I need a T5 fork? Different throughout bearing? Pivot point? Ect)

As usual, Many Thanks!
Jeff

 

1/20/2020 7:51 PM  #2


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

You can use your existing bellhousing, flywheel, clutch, throwout bearing, bearing fork, Z-bar- everything. You will need the 5/8" thick adapter plate that goes between the bellhousing and the transmission along with a new crossmember. Your existing transmission mount will work with the T5 and new crossmember.
Be sure that you get a '93 or earlier T5 with the short input shaft. The '94 and later T5 has a longer input shaft and won't work.

 

1/20/2020 9:47 PM  #3


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

This is Incredible!  Super good news and exiting.

I was not expecting the Toploader clutch or Clutch Spline to match/marry to the T5 input Shaft. Im blown away by this to be honest.

So even the throughout bearing Inner diameter is the correct size for the T5 Input Shaft diameter!?!?

     Thread Starter
 

1/20/2020 10:52 PM  #4


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

Texas! wrote:

You can use your existing bellhousing, flywheel, clutch, throwout bearing, bearing fork, Z-bar- everything. You will need the 5/8" thick adapter plate that goes between the bellhousing and the transmission along with a new crossmember. Your existing transmission mount will work with the T5 and new crossmember.
Be sure that you get a '93 or earlier T5 with the short input shaft. The '94 and later T5 has a longer input shaft and won't work.

I did mine this way and am very happy with it.  Make real sure the adaptor is properly centered on the flywheel.  If it is a little off, you will experience some vibration.  Some adaptors are not as well made as others.

You also need to verify the drive shaft length.  Mine fit perfectly, but some have to shorten or lengthen theirs for fitment.

You will probably be happier is you can get a close ratio trans (2.95 first).  Wide ratios(3.35 first) run out of rpm too fast at take off if you have anything more than a 3.25 rear axle ratio.  I have a 3.00 rear gear with the wide ratio trans and would be happier with the close ratio trans.  That is the gearing I had on the top loader I had before, and it worked perfectly for me..
 


Original owner - 351w,T-5, 4whl disks, power R&P
 

1/21/2020 5:09 AM  #5


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

M1Mustang69 wrote:

So even the throughout bearing Inner diameter is the correct size for the T5 Input Shaft diameter!?!?

Yes.

 

1/21/2020 9:28 AM  #6


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

….and then there are all the little things like speedometer cable length, speedometer cable gear (4 speed gear will not work), reverse light wiring, and shifter selection, which will impact whether you will have to enlarge the shifter hole on the floor pan, and how it fits with whatever console you may or may not have.....

 

1/21/2020 11:52 AM  #7


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

My car is a 70 that I recently installed a t5 out of a 94 GT. I bought is used and overhauled it before I installed it and replace dnt input shaft with the shorter one. I have a 351W with 3.0 rear and the 3.15 1st gear. It is the perfect combination for what I have. I replaced the bellhousing with the 94 using my fork but had to change the fork support because it didn't want to mess with fitting the spacer. But now I can't find a fork boot that will fit the combination. All of the clutch stuff is 1970. I put in a Pro 5.0 shifter and had to round out the tunnel hole for it. That made the original factory shifter boot not fit. I could have used the original Z-Bar but have installed Borgeson powered steering and JBA shorty headers. There is a replacement Z-Bar for each mod but not both so I bought the one for the Borgeson and reformed the Z-Bar to fit around the headers. I replaced the drive shaft with one from a 86 T-Bird that is the perfect shorter length. I bought a pig tail for the back up lights, the speedo cable was the right length slipped right in. I bought two different cross members before I got the right one because of figment issues and exhaust clearance problems. I had to turn the trans mount around and drill holes in it so it would fit onto the trans. All this to say it won't just slip in. Y ou will need to modify something. Cruise RPM for my combination went from 3200 down to 1700 with plenty of reserve power. Around town is mostly in 4th gear below  35-45 mph.

 

1/22/2020 11:51 AM  #8


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

TimC,
With a TopLoader Bell and T5 the shifter hole will have to be worked on?  On my 69 I did Full T5 conversion and it fit perfectly.

MY BIG QUESTUON IS THIS :

I've been noticing a number of people selling used Toploader to T5 Adapter Plates online (local not just eBay.......is this Conversion not good?  Do many people experience driveability issues??

     Thread Starter
 

1/22/2020 1:16 PM  #9


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

I dont think I am the one to answer your question for your year installation but I will tell you what I know. My original transmission was a 3 speed, that bellhousing didn't fit the T5. I don't know if the top loader b/h will work for you. I'm surprised that it did on your 69 so maybe it will. I read on the forums, maybe here, that unless you line up the adapter plate perfectly you could have issues. Plus you need to drill and tap extra bolt holes just to install that plate. I didn't want to mess with possible issues and more modifications. Everything I have done was bolt on simple. I got the b/h off CL or FB. I even used my original sheet metal plate between the block and bellhousing and lucked out with the drive shaft.

 

1/22/2020 3:11 PM  #10


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

M1Mustang69 wrote:

TimC,
With a TopLoader Bell and T5 the shifter hole will have to be worked on?  On my 69 I did Full T5 conversion and it fit perfectly.

MY BIG QUESTUON IS THIS :

I've been noticing a number of people selling used Toploader to T5 Adapter Plates online (local not just eBay.......is this Conversion not good?  Do many people experience driveability issues??

I believe the shifter hole modification is driven by shifter choice.  The aftermarket shifters such as Pro 5.0 shifters are a good sized chunk of aluminum that takes up some real estate.  When I put a T5 in my 66, I had a Pro 5.0 clone and had to expand the shifter hole by about half an inch on the front edge.  I installed the engine, fox bell, T5 with shifter all at once.

As my 65 is such an original car, I did not want to modify the shifter hole, so I used an OEM Ford T5 shifter.  It was a close fit, but clearance is clearance   It does not have the firm shift of a pro 50, but works fine for my driving style.  The OEM shifter is stamped steel that I could install through the shifter hole, and not machined aluminum with shift stops, which requires more space.

I am using a CPC adapter plate for my 65, and it works just fine.  Yes, you need to do minor mods to the original bell to install the plate, but its not rocket science.  I bought my adapter plate used from ebay. I wanted to keep the original clutch linkage & bell. 

 

1/22/2020 8:04 PM  #11


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

TimC wrote:

M1Mustang69 wrote:

TimC,
With a TopLoader Bell and T5 the shifter hole will have to be worked on?  On my 69 I did Full T5 conversion and it fit perfectly.

MY BIG QUESTUON IS THIS :

I've been noticing a number of people selling used Toploader to T5 Adapter Plates online (local not just eBay.......is this Conversion not good?  Do many people experience driveability issues??

I believe the shifter hole modification is driven by shifter choice.  The aftermarket shifters such as Pro 5.0 shifters are a good sized chunk of aluminum that takes up some real estate.  When I put a T5 in my 66, I had a Pro 5.0 clone and had to expand the shifter hole by about half an inch on the front edge.  I installed the engine, fox bell, T5 with shifter all at once.

As my 65 is such an original car, I did not want to modify the shifter hole, so I used an OEM Ford T5 shifter.  It was a close fit, but clearance is clearance   It does not have the firm shift of a pro 50, but works fine for my driving style.  The OEM shifter is stamped steel that I could install through the shifter hole, and not machined aluminum with shift stops, which requires more space.

I am using a CPC adapter plate for my 65, and it works just fine.  Yes, you need to do minor mods to the original bell to install the plate, but its not rocket science.  I bought my adapter plate used from ebay. I wanted to keep the original clutch linkage & bell. 

   I went the same route on my 69 Mustang.
 

 

1/23/2020 1:07 PM  #12


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

Ok, so in summation, collectively do we feel that adapting a T5 on a Toploader Bellhousing, Toploader Clutch and Clutch Configuration (throwout bearing, Z-Bar) is a good conversion that does work!?!?

My car is a 68 with a 4speed toploader out of a truck and currently shifts like butter, but I do like the T5 weight, 1-3 gears and especially that overdrive!

I don't think I'd take on the alternative conversion again, just too invasive and time consuming (not to mention expensive), at least right now. It will be my first season with the car.

     Thread Starter
 

1/23/2020 6:44 PM  #13


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

YES!
I used the adaptor block that the release bearing Arm sits on instead of the adapter that goes between the engine and the bell housing.. Works good. Also use the Z-bar linkage. Had to use an adapter for mounting the Z-bar when I switched to a 91 roller block a few years later.(It was made for the cable clutch set up.
There is a "mod" that can be done to the shifter linkage to shorten the throws between gears. ("one-of-these-days" I'm gonna get one for my  T-5.)
6sally6


"Get busy liv'in............or get busy die'n!!"
 

1/24/2020 8:42 AM  #14


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

6sally6 is referring to yet another method of install that adapts a z-bar linkage to a fox bell.  I do not believe his method is what you are speaking of, as you have stated your desire to use the original bell.  The method he speaks of does eliminate the need for the adapter plate between the trans & bell, if I remember correctly.

 

1/24/2020 9:10 AM  #15


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

Sally unfortunately I don't know of the Adapter block you speak of, but I was asking specifically on Plate that goes between to adapt.
Collectively id like to know if marrying a T5 to a Toploader and factory setup actually works, and works well.
Is the majority satisfied?

     Thread Starter
 

1/24/2020 10:56 AM  #16


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

https://i.ibb.co/PxBZc97/2013-1212-Elizabeth0007.jpg
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https://i.ibb.co/T0Vq84F/2014-0104-Elizabeth0006.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/xHFz9Cg/2014-0104-Elizabeth0018.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/m8G0zsd/2014-0104-Elizabeth0020.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/7WgZBcb/2014-0104-Elizabeth0021.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/zhH5SZV/2014-0202-Elizabeth0001.jpg

 

1/24/2020 2:03 PM  #17


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

AWESOME steve69. That's great! 

So are you pleased?  I noticed you went with the CPC and not modern driveline, any reason in particular?

     Thread Starter
 

1/26/2020 8:47 PM  #18


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

M1Mustang69 wrote:

AWESOME steve69. That's great! 

So are you pleased?  I noticed you went with the CPC and not modern driveline, any reason in particular?

  I bought it on Ebay.  Its held up for 8 years with no issues.  If your doing the clutch linkage Id put the heim joints on them.  Works a lot smoother. 
 

 

1/27/2020 11:17 AM  #19


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

My 66 was born automatic ,but moved to 4 manual during her life . The t5 was one of first thought , with ac -when i bought it .  
Take all necessary parts like adapter to bell and crossmember , yoke and driveshaft .  Used one year with a short 3.80 axle ratio , i wasn't satisfied expecially on first and second gears that defenetly are too short , and 5th was with little non sense revving so high on highway speed . 
Now i moved to 3.40 and things are going well with ratio and car feelings . Have enough power to raise from 1500 rpm in 5th without any issue , and now the wanted 5th as overdrive has sense . 
But it's not all gold ... Had a lot of issue with crossmember that has influence from rubber trans mount .
This also effect the pinion angle so i was in the need to rise the trans with spacers from crossmember. 
Without this spacers the new driveshft and universal joints wear out in just one year. 
Now the latest news regards the 5 th that slip out when without load or in/out gas pedal . 
This happens only after changed with  Pro 5.0 short throw . Never happened before .
At the end , can i be satisfied of all this ? 
well , not completely .  I was aspecting more sharp in shifting and a real short throw, .
Many times i thought was better have an auto trans !

 

1/28/2020 8:35 PM  #20


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

I see. Well I threw in a T5Z in my 69 using all modern driveline parts and I loved it. That car had a 351W beefed up (all but stroked) and 3.73, it was all a little too radical and hungry to go but I had a 0.59 or may have been 0.61OD installed and it woukd purr at 120km/hr.
I took has pinion angle iaaues during install.

The biggest question now is, do I go Modern Driveline, or PCP?

     Thread Starter
 

1/29/2020 12:00 PM  #21


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

*I TOO HAD PINION ANGLE ISSUES DURING INSTALL*.


So Modern Driveline conversion parts or CPC? (Top Loader Conversion to T5)

     Thread Starter
 

2/12/2020 8:26 AM  #22


Re: 1968 Toploader to T5 Swap! Best Option?!?

Alright.

Need help making a decision here on which Conversion Kit to use......

SCOTT DRAKE
CPC
Modern Driveline

???  Insight on your experiences please
 

     Thread Starter
 

Board footera


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