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  •  » KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

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    4/06/2020 8:39 PM  #1

    Nos681
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    From: Atlantic Mine, Michigan
    Registered: 7/14/2016
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    KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    Performed KOEO (key on engine off) first had 67,81,82 codes.
    Second part of KOEO 41, 91, 92 codes.
    Output Test with throttle switches CEL (check engine light) on and off and checked EVP...vacuum state changed.

    Tried performing KOER (key on engine run) never starts.

    Even placed jumper between connectors for pin 30 and 46 in engine compartment.
    Same result multiple times.
    Yes...engine was at operating temperature before starting tests.
    Even with this jumper installed, code 67 still appears.
    Clutch switch not used.

    Disconnected jumper to clear codes ..11 on second half of KOEO.
    Haven’t disconnected battery yet.

    Want to make sure I didn’t miss anything.

    I thought I went through all these test a couple of years ago and had code 11’s.

    I used the following for my 92 wiring.
    AirB and AirD deleted. Evp and Egr in place.

    http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/91-93_5.0_EEC_Wiring_Diagram.gif

    Last edited by Nos681 (4/07/2020 1:15 PM)

     

    4/07/2020 6:05 AM  #2

    TKOPerformance
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    From: Newark, DE
    Registered: 12/15/2014
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    Codes 81 and 82 are for the TAB and TAD solenoids, you are getting these codes because I'm guessing those solenoids aren't in place.  Those codes also should not set a CEL in a car with Mass Air.  If you want the codes gone install a 75 Ohm resistor between the two wires that went to each of those solenoids. 

    Codes 41 and 91 are RH and LH O2 sensor codes (lean).  Code 92 is LH O2 rich. 

    These 5 codes together to me would suggest you should be looking for a vacuum leak somewhere. 

    For the code 67 have you checked that there are no breaks in the wiring?

     

    4/07/2020 7:34 AM  #3

    Bullet Bob
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    From: Montrose, Colorado
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    Agree with Tom.  Also, Dan I'm sure when I've run a KOER test I had to start the engine, then the test takes over and runs the RPM up and down and performs all the tests.

    I just went through chasing down a CEL and codes 41 and 91 (HEGOs not switching, lean.  Found the bolt holding the IAB on were very loose.  Duh.  Big vac leak.

    BB1

    Last edited by Bullet Bob (4/07/2020 7:36 AM)

    "you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
     

    4/07/2020 9:52 AM  #4

    Nos681
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    From: Atlantic Mine, Michigan
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    Bob and Tom...😂

    Definitely on right track about intake.
    Found puddle of coolant under car this morning,
    Can see a track down back of engine.

    That is correct TAB and TAD aren’t connected.
    Thanks about 41 & 91...O2 sensors lean...vacuum leak common to both sides


    I haven’t disconnected battery yet.
    Still confused about two things.
    67... with or without jumper still had code
    From my understanding, until 67 is cleared...will not go into KOER test?

    Last edited by Nos681 (4/07/2020 10:09 AM)

       •Thread Starter
     

    4/07/2020 10:09 AM  #5

    Bullet Bob
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    According to the info I have code 67 means "Neutral Safety Ckt Failure" in the KOEO test only.  In the KOER Self-Test it means "AC Ckt On during KOER Self-Test".

    Are you saying you cannot start the car from the key?  The KOER tests I have run on the Heap and on the Falcon Project had me start the engine then initiate the KOER test.

    BB1

    "you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
     

    4/07/2020 10:15 AM  #6

    Bullet Bob
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    The info I just posted is from RJM years ago.  I just checked the Probst book and he says the same thing.  I don't think any Self-Test on an EEC-IV will self start.

    BB1

    "you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
     

    4/07/2020 10:35 AM  #7

    Nos681
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    From: Atlantic Mine, Michigan
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    I can start car.
    Get it to operating temp...aka drive for errands for parking brake.

    After it’s at operating temp.
    Perform KOEO...no problem pulling all codes (Fast codes, hard faults, separator pulse, memory codes,  and output state tests...changes state...on/off with throttle operation... CEL, AIRB/TAB not used, AIRD/TAD not used, EVR in use, and EGR in use).

    Turn off after reading all codes for at least 10-15 seconds.
    Start the car with jumper still in place.  Still have code 67.
    Never goes into KOER test .
    Turn car off.

    Start KOEO, remove jumper during test to clear codes.
    Turn off ignition.
    Start KOEO again...67,81,82 hard faults still there...memory code is 11.
    Called it a night before something breaks!😜

       •Thread Starter
     

    4/07/2020 11:31 AM  #8

    TKOPerformance
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    From: Newark, DE
    Registered: 12/15/2014
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    So I'm 100% clear on your setup, the car is an auto or a manual trans?  The clutch switch is connected, not connected, or jumped out?

    Regardless, if the circuit is jumped and you still get a code there must be a break in the wiring somewhere that's not allowing it to complete the circuit.  I would advise checking resistance and continuity from the switch to the origination of each wire. 

    There were a lot of vacuum connections on the 5.0.  Is the EGR still in place and functional?  With no emissions devices in place you still need manifold vacuum to the FPR and MAP sensors.  If the EGR is functioning you need the EVR connected, which you could just connect to manifold vacuum, and then to the EGR. 

     

    4/07/2020 11:55 AM  #9

    Bullet Bob
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    I have run the KOEO with the jumper years ago but never the KOER.  Now I use a code reader and that works very well for the KOER test.

    BB1

    "you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
     

    4/07/2020 1:14 PM  #10

    Nos681
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    From: Atlantic Mine, Michigan
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    Bob...
    I believe even with a 67 code, haven’t dug into codes for a while.
    i believe even with a reader would not perform KOER test with this  67 code present.
    Haven’t found my notes when doing conversion 3 years ago.

    TKO...

    manual t5 (haven’t connected any wiring back ...project after brakes..backup lights, NGS, and VSS). No clutch start safety switch...not adding it right now...later possibly. Have pins 30 and 46 in engine compartment to jumper as needed.

    No TAB or TAD...haven’t installed resistors yet...engine was fully operational prior to swap with them in place and connected (no codes when connected). Not concerned about these codes.

    Yes w/ EVP and EGR...(manifold-EVP-EGR...that’s it all new vacuum lines)

    I did find my problem....ME!

    Apparently, when I was making a new brake line for the firewall crossover.  I had disconnected the harness that runs to the Oxygen sensors, which also has the clutch switch wiring that I jumper in engine compartment for KOER tests.

    Was able to perform KOEO AND KOER tests.
    Only have 81/82 hard faults and  11 on continuous memory.
    Yes!!!

    Now to fix coolant leak.
    Thanks for help guys!

       •Thread Starter
     

    4/07/2020 1:50 PM  #11

    Bullet Bob
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    Way cool, Dan.  Always better when you figger it out yourownself.  Now, if you could tell me why my AFR gauge won't work I'd send you a pile of brownie points.

    BB1

    "you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
     

    4/07/2020 2:24 PM  #12

    Nos681
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    From: Atlantic Mine, Michigan
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    I’ll take a look-see.
    you’re way ahead of me in that respect.

       •Thread Starter
     

    4/07/2020 4:05 PM  #13

    TKOPerformance
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    From: Newark, DE
    Registered: 12/15/2014
    Posts: 7,511

    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    No problem, glad you got it resolved.

     

    4/08/2020 1:42 PM  #14

    Nos681
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    From: Atlantic Mine, Michigan
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    Re: KOER Test not working-RESOLVED

    Bob and Tom,

    I found my reference to the code 67.
    Page 12 and 17.

    As for the 41 & 91 codes in “Continuous Memory”...
    No O2 sensor detected. Page 16 & 17.

    At least I know the ECM tried to tell me to connect them. 😂


    https://www.jegs.com/InstallationInstructions/300/397/397-M-12071-A50.pdf

       •Thread Starter
     

     

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