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4/04/2020 4:12 PM  #1


Alternator doesn't alt.



Now is a perfect time to install my G3 alternator that's been laying around for awhile. I picked it up yesterday after the alternator shop went through it and installed it. It doesn't work. After troubleshooting I ended up taking apart the regulator. This is what the inside of the PA Performance regulator looks like. My Mustang is a 70 and doesn't use the "I" connection, so the regulator doesn't look right to me. According to the directions the "F" has been disconnected and tied off. Only the "A" and "S" would conceivably be used. You can see in the pic that PA Performance doesn't have them connected meaning this regulator is either defective or not needed. That little ground wire is not connected to anything except the body on the one side. After looking at my Mustang wiring diagram, it looks to me like the A and the S will actually only work the brake failure light. The reason for useing PA Performance's regulator was so I could still use my amp gauge.  Can anybody enlighten me? Do I need to take the alternator back to the shop?


70, ragtop 351W/416 stroker Edel Performer heads w pro flow 4, Comp roller 35-421-8. T5
 

4/04/2020 4:57 PM  #2


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

But...
An external regulator is not used with the 3G alternator ...


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
 

4/04/2020 5:33 PM  #3


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

I'd consider getting rid of the dummy regulator, and converting to a voltmeter.
http://www.rccinnovations.com/index.php?show=menu-mustang-all#volts
 


"Those telephone poles were like a picket fence"
 

4/04/2020 6:14 PM  #4


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.



Hope this can help ya.

 

4/05/2020 7:23 PM  #5


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.



I ditched the fake regulator and wired as in the schematic. It works like it is supposed to. A/C, headlights, and fan on still holds 14 volts on the installed volt meter at idle. That fake regulator as advertised is supposed to keep the factory amp meter working but for my electrical system it isn't connected to anything.

I don't know how to turn it right side up??

Last edited by HudginJ3 (4/05/2020 7:26 PM)


70, ragtop 351W/416 stroker Edel Performer heads w pro flow 4, Comp roller 35-421-8. T5
     Thread Starter
 

4/05/2020 7:24 PM  #6


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

The plug that came with the regulator, the 3 wire plug that plugs into the 3G, how do you have it hooked up. Three wires white, green & yellow. White plugs back into the 3G. Yellow monitors the battery voltage. Some people connect it to the large post on the alternator some like to run it over to the battery terminal on the solenoid.Green? If you look at NOS681's picture, at the bottom left on the alternator there is a  LT Green/Red wire. That goes back to the ignition switch for switched positive. You need to connect that LT Green/Red wire to the Green wire in the 3G harness.

Last edited by wsinsle (4/06/2020 6:54 AM)


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4/05/2020 7:32 PM  #7


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

I connected the white/black wire back to the alternator,  the yellow wire to the big post on the alternator and the green/red wire to the "I" post on the starter solenoid.


70, ragtop 351W/416 stroker Edel Performer heads w pro flow 4, Comp roller 35-421-8. T5
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4/06/2020 5:23 PM  #8


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

The green/red wire going to the 3G requires +12 Volt switched positive. I don't know how close to +12 that has to be. The 'I' terminal on the solenoid has +12 volts during start but drops to about +9 volts when key is in run. That is because of the #16 pink resistor wire.I would look for a solid 12 volt wire as stated in my last post. I think the fake regulator was made to work with a car with a ALT light not an amp meter. But if it works it works,
 

Last edited by wsinsle (4/06/2020 5:36 PM)


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4/07/2020 11:32 AM  #9


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

I discarded the regulator harness at the blue connection and connected the green/red wire to the keyed wire there. I have 14V at the battery now. I had 14V when the green/red wire was connected to the "I" position on the solenoid. The volts there with the key on was less than 5V. If the alternator makes 14V at both connections what is the advantage of one position over the other? Im guessing less stress on the alternator?


70, ragtop 351W/416 stroker Edel Performer heads w pro flow 4, Comp roller 35-421-8. T5
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4/07/2020 4:40 PM  #10


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

HudginJ3 wrote:

If the alternator makes 14V at both connections what is the advantage of one position over the other? I'm guessing less stress on the alternator?

This is my thought, You said the 'I' terminal measured < 5 volts with the green wire from the 3-G connected to it. This is the voltage that feeds the coil. At run, the coil is suppose to have around 9 volts. So you my be starving the coil for voltage during run, causing lesser spark. Now that you have moved the 3-G green wire from the the 'I' terminal, you could measure the 'I' terminal to see what your coil voltage is. You have  to be in Run position and the points closed or jumpered to get a correct reading. Caution don't leave it like this for a long period. That is why they created the Acc position on the ignition switch. Don't want to listen to the car radio for 1/2 hour in the run position if the motor shut off with the points closed. This can burn up a coil.


If this forum can't fix it, it isn't broke.
 

4/10/2020 12:44 PM  #11


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

Are you still running points ignition?  If not, 12 volts is the normal voltage supplied to a 12 volt coil and aftermarket or Duraspark II distributor.  i.e.; pink wire is typically removed or bypassed in that case.


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
 

4/10/2020 9:03 PM  #12


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

MS wrote:

Are you still running points ignition?  If not, 12 volts is the normal voltage supplied to a 12 volt coil and aftermarket or Duraspark II distributor.  i.e.; pink wire is typically removed or bypassed in that case.

Thanks for the heads up MS, I switched to the Duraspark ignition awhile back before the Mich bash.  After reading wsinsle's post I checked the voltage at the ignition wire. The wire on my car is brown not pink so I figured is was 12v. When I made the switch I used a Painless wire harness to fit connect the coil. The ignition wire on that harness is brown also. They both have 4.5v with the engine off. I didn't check it running. I was able to connect it to the keyed wire that the regulator used to be connected to. It's 12v. 


70, ragtop 351W/416 stroker Edel Performer heads w pro flow 4, Comp roller 35-421-8. T5
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4/10/2020 9:10 PM  #13


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

Nos681 wrote:



Hope this can help ya.

I redrew the schematic from my 70 manual so I could make sense of it. It came together a little easier. Thanks for your help.
 


70, ragtop 351W/416 stroker Edel Performer heads w pro flow 4, Comp roller 35-421-8. T5
     Thread Starter
 

4/11/2020 2:22 PM  #14


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

HudginJ3 wrote:

MS wrote:

Are you still running points ignition?  If not, 12 volts is the normal voltage supplied to a 12 volt coil and aftermarket or Duraspark II distributor.  i.e.; pink wire is typically removed or bypassed in that case.

Thanks for the heads up MS, I switched to the Duraspark ignition awhile back before the Mich bash.  After reading wsinsle's post I checked the voltage at the ignition wire. The wire on my car is brown not pink so I figured is was 12v. When I made the switch I used a Painless wire harness to fit connect the coil. The ignition wire on that harness is brown also. They both have 4.5v with the engine off. I didn't check it running. I was able to connect it to the keyed wire that the regulator used to be connected to. It's 12v. 

Sorry, bad assumption on my part, When you mentioned connection to the "I" terminal I assumed points. I removed that wire when I went to 12 volt coil.

I know after market harnesses don't use a pink resister wire they use a ballast resister. I'm curious, If you removed or had no ballast after up grading to Dura Spark, It's strange that there was such low voltage at the 'I' terminal. It should have been +12 like MS said.


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4/11/2020 2:58 PM  #15


Re: Alternator doesn't alt.

The stock wire and aftermarket wire are both brown. They both had 4.5v. It ran/runs fine as far as I can tell. I just seems to fire quicker now. My car never had a ballast resister. One came with the wire harness kit. The directions said not to use it unless the coil has a placard on it to do so. It doesn't.


70, ragtop 351W/416 stroker Edel Performer heads w pro flow 4, Comp roller 35-421-8. T5
     Thread Starter
 

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