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5/03/2021 9:58 PM  #26


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Motor mounts will be fine.  You need a FRONT sump pan and the proper oil pick up.  You also need to change the  front timing cover or modify the one you have for a front dipstick...side dipstick won't work with the front sump pan.  The Fox exhaust system will not work so you'll need headers that fit or HIPO manifolds.
The rear mount for the AOD needs to be a couple of inches further to the rear.  A mount to accomplish this is probably available on the aftermarket or you can make one if you are so inclined.  I've made two...not terribly difficult.
If you keep the HO single serpentine front dress you'll need a radiator with lower hose on the left.  I would also recommend going to a 20" radiator at least.  You can trim the core support and go to a 24" if you want.  I have a 20" aluminum and our car runs at the 195 degree 'stat under just about all conditions.
You need a high pressure fuel pump either in the tank or external.  There are a few extra tank systems out there or commercial conversion tanks with submerged pumps.  I've been running a Walbro pump externally, just in front of the tank, for over 30k miles with no problem.  Regardless of how you go with the pump you need to double the fuel plumbing.  I used the stock fuel line for the return and made a mirror image line on the right side for supply.  The system runs right near 40 psi so you need to do the source line RIGHT!  I used all steel line or short sections of nylon for flex.  The Ford girdle fittings work fine in the engine bay and the duck-bill fittings work great at the filter...you must run a filter and the standard late Ford type works well just after the pump.
If you do keep the stock fuel tank...I have a 22gal from a 71-73 Mustang...you will need to make some provision to vent it.  This is a "circulating" fuel system with the pressure regulator on the fuel rail.  Fuel returning to the tank get warmed up at the engine and will, on a long trip, raise the temperature of the fuel in the tank quite a bit.  The stock 65 gas cap is vented to allow air IN...but not OUT.  At least that's how the one on my 66 works.  After driving the car from western Colorado to Glaicer and back I discovered that I had like 2" less depth in the trunk.  Nuff said!  I ran my vent forward...more plumbing...to an 89 Ford canister mounted behind the right front wheel.  Then I enabled Canister Purge.   Works great.
Well, that should get you started.  We can talk about electrics next time...or someone else will chime in.
Lots of info on the Web.  Lots of differing opinions and there are a number of folks running EFI on here who will be happy  to tell you what has, or has not, worked for them.

BB1

Last edited by Bullet Bob (5/03/2021 10:04 PM)


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

5/04/2021 4:41 AM  #27


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

BB...I thought you had a 1970 22 gallon tank?

 

5/04/2021 6:06 AM  #28


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Nos681 wrote:

BB...I thought you had a 1970 22 gallon tank?

I had a 20 which swelled up like a beach ball.  Now I have a 22...thought they  were from the 71+.


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

5/04/2021 7:40 AM  #29


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Jeff,

First, welcome to the forum.
Second, as a point of reference, when we say the left side or right side, that references the side of the car as you're seated in the driver's seat.

Here's additional info to what BB provide with respect to oil pans, etc.

Order an oil pan for a 65 mustang and.
The following Melling brand parts will take care of oil pump, pick up tube/screen and drive shaft:
Oil pump- Melling # M68
Pickup screen- 68-S
Pump drive shaft: IS-68

Rockauto and Summit are good sources for parts.

Both my mustangs are sporting 5.0 HO engines so, I'm familiar with what you'll be needing for this process.

 

5/04/2021 11:47 AM  #30


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Be careful with the fuel pickup.  I've bought them for 16, 20, &22 gal tanks and they all were identical.   The wrappings indicated the proper pickup for the tank.  Different tanks, same pickup.  Size of a 16 gal tank.  I've tried and tried to make an adjustment to no avail.  I think someone here has given us a way to adjust the pickup.  Don't remember who.

Right now with a 20 gal tank, at 1/4 full a fill-up takes 12 gal indicating a 16 gal tank.


Original owner - 351w,T-5, 4whl disks, power R&P
 

5/04/2021 3:09 PM  #31


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Hey Josh what kind of mpg do you get? Right now my 289 gets 13 to 18 depending on how I drive. Like if I go 60mph on the freeway I can get 18. 3.0 gears and 25.7 tall tires.

What kind of timing chain cover do I need?

Can I just modify my current 16gal gas tank (its 10yrs old with 11k miles of usage only)


65 Vert (UCA mod,4bbl, hipo ex, 17x8), 2013 C-Max (hitch & cargo net), 2018 Cherokee (through bumper hitch)
     Thread Starter
 

5/04/2021 5:29 PM  #32


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

MPG? What's that?! Actually, my setup differs from yours in that I have a carb vs EFI. So, I don't know, nor care, what my gas mileage is.

On your timing cover, I'd first consider just drilling a hole for the dipstick tube and call it good. Ain't difficult. Google that procedure, there's good info out there on it.


Also, when you do that, you'll
need to drill a hole thru your alternator bracket for the dipstick to pass through.

Back in the day when this forum was really high tech, I posted pics showing this. Those days and pics are now gone.

Be glad to send you some pics of my setup....send me a private message with your email address.

Last edited by josh-kebob (5/04/2021 5:30 PM)

 

5/06/2021 5:05 PM  #33


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

I took some pictures, looks like its already been converted to front sump
https://imgur.com/wLnul8n
https://imgur.com/BNYEubq
https://imgur.com/RN2uwzb

Also... if I modify the motor

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/pts/d/el-verano-alum-heads-roller-rockers/7316493674.html
I know nothing about that brand, I would have chosen AFR 165's if I did this, but that looks like a deal?


Josh - Drilling a hole, that I can do. Just large enough for the dipstick tube right? And the Alt bracket if needed.

 

Last edited by JeffK (5/06/2021 5:40 PM)


65 Vert (UCA mod,4bbl, hipo ex, 17x8), 2013 C-Max (hitch & cargo net), 2018 Cherokee (through bumper hitch)
     Thread Starter
 

5/06/2021 6:20 PM  #34


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

I believe the pro comps are made in chiner...some feedback hasn't been good. But as always, do some research.

Remove the "tab" from the dipstick tube. It has two small spot welds so it removes easily.

The hole you drilled in the alt bracket keeps the tube supported.

When I have time, I'll remove my alt and take a picture for you.

 

5/06/2021 10:08 PM  #35


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

are there any differences between AOD and AODE?

 

5/07/2021 6:20 AM  #36


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

autojames wrote:

are there any differences between AOD and AODE?

Lots!  Besides internal improvements, the AOD is all mechanical, like all pre-electronic transmissions.  The AODE is  controlled electronically, which means you need some sort of computer to tell it when to shift.
Also, the the AOD  performs TC lockup by using a double input shaft which is weak in high HP situations.  The AODE had a clutch in the TC for lockup that is controlled by the electronic controller.
And if you are going AODE you may as well go to the 4R70W which is the last version of the AODE and has all the improvements plus lower first and second gears hence the "W" for wide ratio.


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

8/03/2025 10:31 PM  #37


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Wow it only took me 4 years to get started on this project. Today I removed from the donor car
1. Cooling system
2. Hydroboost setup (bmw setup)
3. Disconnected every electrical connection to the motor. BTW the wiring harness has a lot of spliced connections with the donor bmw. I am not sure I can reuse the wiring harness or I might need to splice it to the 65 mustang.
4. Disconnected the B&M shifter (top side).
5. Disconnected exhaust pipes and drive shaft.

I think all I have left is to disconnect the speedo, undo motor mounts and transmission mount.

The real questions will be forthcoming. Once I pull the motor and transmission, I'll then pull the 289 and 3spd out of the convertible. I'll swap oil pans and pickups.

*I have no fab skills, no electrical skills, and I have almost no idea what all the electronics are or do. I'm hoping to keep the EFI, mostly want to have decent MPG.

Last edited by JeffK (8/03/2025 10:34 PM)


65 Vert (UCA mod,4bbl, hipo ex, 17x8), 2013 C-Max (hitch & cargo net), 2018 Cherokee (through bumper hitch)
     Thread Starter
 

8/04/2025 5:57 AM  #38


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Assuming you are keeping the engine stock?  I would acquaint yourself with all the sensors and how the EFI works.  EECIV is quite simple for EFI, especially by modern standards.  

 

8/04/2025 6:46 AM  #39


 

8/04/2025 11:37 AM  #40


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

TKOPerformance wrote:

Assuming you are keeping the engine stock?  I would acquaint yourself with all the sensors and how the EFI works.  EECIV is quite simple for EFI, especially by modern standards.  

Stock for now, but AFR Comp 165cc heads,roller rockers and the minimum upgrades to the intake setup to accomodate (exhaust side is good already).

Does that change your advice?
 


65 Vert (UCA mod,4bbl, hipo ex, 17x8), 2013 C-Max (hitch & cargo net), 2018 Cherokee (through bumper hitch)
     Thread Starter
 

8/04/2025 11:38 AM  #41


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

YES! Thank you.

BTW I have a question, my 5.0 was shoved into a 1977 BMW, they used the BMW fuse box which I cut off and junked. Do I use the 65's fuse box or buy something different?
 


65 Vert (UCA mod,4bbl, hipo ex, 17x8), 2013 C-Max (hitch & cargo net), 2018 Cherokee (through bumper hitch)
     Thread Starter
 

8/04/2025 12:45 PM  #42


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

I think the worst thing you could do as someone unfamiliar with wiring and EFI is to try to use some oddball hacked up harness.

No disrespect meant to the previous owner.

There's a few sources out there that supply an EFI harness for Early Fords. It might cost more up front, but will save loads of time on installation not to mention avoiding potential issues after install or down the road. It's a lot to absorb, so just go slow and attack it in small pieces.

There's places like High Performance Academy that have great wiring courses and basic electrical stuff that can help get you up to speed.

 

8/05/2025 5:49 AM  #43


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

JeffK wrote:

TKOPerformance wrote:

Assuming you are keeping the engine stock?  I would acquaint yourself with all the sensors and how the EFI works.  EECIV is quite simple for EFI, especially by modern standards.  

Stock for now, but AFR Comp 165cc heads,roller rockers and the minimum upgrades to the intake setup to accomodate (exhaust side is good already).

Does that change your advice?
 

Not if you are keeping the EECIV system, because stock or modified you will need to understand how it works to troubleshoot it in the future.  The issue with swapping parts is that you are going to need to learn how to tune the system or find a place that can, or swap to a different ECU.  There are companies that make plug and play modern ECUs for the EECIV harness.

If you are going to change the heads then you also need to change the throttle body, mass air, and should probably swap to 24lbs/hr injectors.  An adjustable FPR is also a good idea.  You'll also want a better TFI module or you'll start having spark scatter above 3,000RPM.  A coil is also a good idea (Screamin Demon is IMO the best) Unfortunately what you'll find with an EFI engine is that swapping 1 or 2 parts doesn't yield the results expected without supporting modifications.  These engines are truly a system and if everything is not up to snuff you'll have problems.  When EFI first came out I remember thinking you could just swap parts and not touch the EFI and the system would learn and optimize itself.  It will typically allow the modified engine to run, but its limited by its programming, so it can only tweak the fuel and spark within a defined set of parameters.  IME its not enough for a major airflow change like a head swap.  Just putting headers and full exhaust on an otherwise stock 5.0 required a TFI module at the minimum, and the module worked a lot better with a better coil.  Tuning would then net another 0.1 second drop in 1/4 mile ET, which equates to 10HP.  
 

 

8/05/2025 5:49 AM  #44


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Raymond_B wrote:

I think the worst thing you could do as someone unfamiliar with wiring and EFI is to try to use some oddball hacked up harness.

No disrespect meant to the previous owner.

There's a few sources out there that supply an EFI harness for Early Fords. It might cost more up front, but will save loads of time on installation not to mention avoiding potential issues after install or down the road. It's a lot to absorb, so just go slow and attack it in small pieces.

There's places like High Performance Academy that have great wiring courses and basic electrical stuff that can help get you up to speed.

Yes, also THIS.
 

 

8/05/2025 6:08 AM  #45


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

You’ve got a lot on your hands making this swap and I wouldn’t make any changes from 'stock' until you have it installed, running and tuned as-is.  You are on a very large learning curve, don’t make it more complicated.


65 Fastback, 351W, 5-speed, 4 wheel discs, 9" rear,  R&C Front End.
 

8/05/2025 2:34 PM  #46


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Maybe swapping to an airgap and 600 cfm carb is a better easier route....

Is that more viable? I'm going to want to run AC (not that I have any parts yet, PS still need to buy stuff with that, but I suppose the 5.0 power steering can be adapted to a borgenson steering box.
 

Last edited by JeffK (8/05/2025 2:36 PM)


65 Vert (UCA mod,4bbl, hipo ex, 17x8), 2013 C-Max (hitch & cargo net), 2018 Cherokee (through bumper hitch)
     Thread Starter
 

8/05/2025 3:35 PM  #47


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Jeff
I went the EFI route several years ago. I like the way it starts and runs. I bought a Tanks inc fuel injection tank, and bought  a Painless wiring harness off fleabay. I lengthened mine to go to the trunk. I could have put the ECM under the dash or behind the kick panel but that gets tiight. 
It took me quite a while to install everything an get it figured out. Had a lot of help from the guys on this forum and i also read alot of info  on the web. Mostly the same sources as Dan had put up earlier. 
Going the carb route would probably get you on the road faster. 
 


67 Coupe, 5.0 EEC IV Fuel injected. T5, 3:70 rear
 

8/06/2025 6:38 AM  #48


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

JeffK wrote:

Maybe swapping to an airgap and 600 cfm carb is a better easier route....

Is that more viable? I'm going to want to run AC (not that I have any parts yet, PS still need to buy stuff with that, but I suppose the 5.0 power steering can be adapted to a borgenson steering box.
 

Some guys I think used the Ford pump for the conversion.  My preference would be to keep the Saginaw pump, as its less problem prone, and use an adapter that mounts it in the 5.0 PS cradle. 
 

 

8/06/2025 6:45 AM  #49


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Lee makes a Saginaw pump in Ford clothing.  Looks just like a stock 5.0 pump but it is all Saginaw innards.  No moaning, works great with Borgeson box,   JKB put me onto them a couple of years ago and I ran it with my early Borg.  Now I have the new Borg and still running the Lee pump.
Sorry about the shifter pix.  My ability to post pix seems to have gone away....again. I think you posted your email in a previous post so I'll get some pix to you that way.


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

8/07/2025 12:25 PM  #50


Re: Best resources for 5.0 swap?

Jeff..........were you Jeff of Ga.  many moons ago ?
6sally6


Get busy Liv'in or get busy Die'n....Host of the 2020 Bash at the Beach/The only Bash that got cancelled  )8
 

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