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8/08/2022 2:44 PM  #1


Help with bellhousing indexing

What do you think of these numbers?
Underlined ones are second pass

Can this thing really be that far out?


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
 

8/08/2022 3:16 PM  #2


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

You might have to use offset dowels.


Good work ain't cheap, Cheap work ain't good!   Simple Man
 

8/08/2022 3:46 PM  #3


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

Better readings


private image upload


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
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8/08/2022 4:14 PM  #4


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

If you were racing you would do something but for a driver I can't believe .030 of misalignment of the transmission input would have the effect you get.  I couldn't believe the sound and vibe you get above 75 mph.  You could move it toward 8:00 by .010 but I don't think will cure the issue.


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

8/08/2022 4:18 PM  #5


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

Looking to get it as good as possible.  I am going to get some 0.010” offset dowels and push it down and to the left.


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     Thread Starter
 

8/08/2022 4:27 PM  #6


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

The trans manufacturer called out an allowable amount of run out or whatever the term is. Seems like it was .005 per side. Don’t quote me. I watched a few videos to get the hang of it.

From the reading I did, premature failure of the input shaft was the concern of improper alignment, not vibration.


I bought offset dowel pins from RobbMc performance. Once the alignment was set, the pins could be locked in place.


John  -- 67 Mustang Coupe 390 5 speed
 

8/08/2022 5:03 PM  #7


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

Just a thought, did you verify the hole is round?


Good work ain't cheap, Cheap work ain't good!   Simple Man
 

8/08/2022 5:07 PM  #8


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

Rudi wrote:

Just a thought, did you verify the hole is round?

 
All I can do is see if several measurements across the hole are same. It fits nice and snug on the bearing retainer. Bell also fits snug on dowels in the block.

Seems like offset dowels only come in .007, .014, .021”


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     Thread Starter
 

8/08/2022 6:50 PM  #9


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

MS wrote:

Rudi wrote:

Just a thought, did you verify the hole is round?

 
All I can do is see if several measurements across the hole are same. It fits nice and snug on the bearing retainer. Bell also fits snug on dowels in the block.

Seems like offset dowels only come in .007, .014, .021”

 
Anyone with a lathe can make any offset you want, just sayin!😃


Good work ain't cheap, Cheap work ain't good!   Simple Man
 

8/08/2022 8:41 PM  #10


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

I agree with Bolted.  Off center there would cause input shaft bearing failure before anything else, I'd think.  Vibration, not so much with the amounts you are reading.  But then, I used to mess with Model A's.
 


"you get what you pay for, good work isn't cheap, and there are NO free lunches...PERIOD!"
 

8/08/2022 8:47 PM  #11


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

Anybody got one out of car to measure to see what their measurements are to compare?

 

Last edited by BILLY WALTON from GEORGIA (8/08/2022 8:52 PM)


Its really me....I fixed my caps lock .
 

8/08/2022 9:12 PM  #12


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

Seems like to me that input shaft misalignment could also cause clutch chatter/failure.


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     Thread Starter
 

8/09/2022 6:46 AM  #13


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

I have a pic of the measurements I took from 12, 3, 6,  and 9 o'clock positions. Found the hard drive they are on Sunday....couldn't find it for 5-6 months!! I would post them, but the pics are still at home. 

Getting the alignment pin out was a pain for the one in the blind hole. The other was easy to tap out from the engine side. Can't remember where they are positioned on a Windsor block. 

 


John  -- 67 Mustang Coupe 390 5 speed
 

8/09/2022 8:25 AM  #14


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

Since the clutch is indexed to the flywheel when the pressure plate is bolted down, the transmission is not part of the equation.  Then once you slip the transmission into place and bolt it up, any misalignment will be putting pressure on the input shaft bearing.  However, once you repress the clutch the first time, the pressure should neutralize on the clutch itself and instead be shared between the input bearing/bushing and the transmission input shaft bearing.  It would seem to me that distant between these two bearing points is great enough that the play in the input shaft is already enough to absorb it.  Of course, I don't actually know.  This is just how I see it.  Regardless, I don't think it would cause any clutch chatter.


1968 T-code Coupe with a 302.  Nice car, no show stopper for sure, but I like it.
 

8/09/2022 8:38 AM  #15


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

Measure the play at the end of your transmission input shaft.  I'm curious how tight it is now.  This might help you identify how much wiggle room you have.


1968 T-code Coupe with a 302.  Nice car, no show stopper for sure, but I like it.
 

8/09/2022 9:01 AM  #16


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

The disc would be slightly off center from the flywheel, but only a few thousandths. Every little bit helps when trying to eliminate chatter and vibration.
I agree the small misalignment I have is not causing my 80mph+ vibration.
Trying to leave no stone unturned.


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     Thread Starter
 

8/10/2022 8:19 AM  #17


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

I realized this morning you have a Ford bell housing. Those numbers are really out there. Have you confirmed the hole is round? Seems like Ford would  have done a better job. Silly question, was the dial indicator stable? I had a heck of a time getting mine stuffed in there where it didn't move around.   




 

Last edited by Bolted to Floor (8/10/2022 8:20 AM)


John  -- 67 Mustang Coupe 390 5 speed
 

8/11/2022 11:21 AM  #18


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

What doesn’t look right is in the first picture you are unable to repeat the same numbers.  Second is off so much from the first that I would question the setup/method of measuring.   Something is not stable. Unless you are getting repeatable numbers.   Some times to much of the indicator can cause some movement it the way it’s mounted but it doesn’t look like that is the case here.

 

8/11/2022 12:12 PM  #19


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

RTM wrote:

What doesn’t look right is in the first picture you are unable to repeat the same numbers. Second is off so much from the first that I would question the setup/method of measuring. Something is not stable. Unless you are getting repeatable numbers. Some times to much of the indicator can cause some movement it the way it’s mounted but it doesn’t look like that is the case here.

I agree w/RTM regarding not getting repeatable numbers.  I had this happen to me when checking piston to valve clearances until I established a more solid mounting for the dial indicator.

 


65 Fastback, 351W, 5-speed, 4 wheel discs, 9" rear,  R&C Front End.
 

8/11/2022 6:06 PM  #20


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

Tranny is back in.


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     Thread Starter
 

8/12/2022 8:48 AM  #21


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

I always take the dowels out and smack the bell housing around with the bolts snug until I get within a couple thou on average. Then I drill. ream and smack in some new locating dowels.  I have some hollow ones that I can put a bolt through with a lock nut to keep all that horsepower from working them out. The worst bell I did was a T5 one that I had to mill flat to get it real close. I like to see within .002!

 

8/12/2022 3:18 PM  #22


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

BobE wrote:

RTM wrote:

What doesn’t look right is in the first picture you are unable to repeat the same numbers. Second is off so much from the first that I would question the setup/method of measuring. Something is not stable. Unless you are getting repeatable numbers. Some times to much of the indicator can cause some movement it the way it’s mounted but it doesn’t look like that is the case here.

I agree w/RTM regarding not getting repeatable numbers.  I had this happen to me when checking piston to valve clearances until I established a more solid mounting for the dial indicator.

 

Agreed
That is why the second picture with a single set of numbers was a new setup. I did two revolutions and got same numbers.


Money you enjoy wasting is NOT wasted money... unless your wife finds out.
     Thread Starter
 

8/13/2022 10:28 AM  #23


Re: Help with bellhousing indexing

I ended up making a bracket that bolted to the flywheel at a couple of clutch mount holes with the right size shaft sticking out for the indicator. The magnet thing didn't thrill me.

 

Board footera


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